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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Does anyone ever have a "are we the baddies"* moment?

662 replies

Menstrualcycledisplayteam · 27/02/2021 21:39

  • it's a Mitchell & Webb sketch, probably on Youtube.

I'm a bit disheartened this week, if I'm honest. I sometimes feel like this is a fight that we're just not going to win. Two main things recently, one personal, one geo-political I suppose.

On the geo-political level, I look across the Pond to the US, where the only people who are saying the same things as us are frigging Rand Paul and Marjorie Taylor Greene, neither of which are people that I associate my politics as being anywhere close to. There is just no bloody way that the Left, my home, will align with us now, given who our "allies" are in the States. They just can't, even those that agree with us will never position themselves as having the same concerns as Marjorie Q-Anon Parkland Taylor Bloody Greene.

The second is personal. I work for a large global organisation in a senior role. We had our Global Leadership "Away Day" a few weeks ago (on Teams, of course) and there was a presentation from some US colleagues on LGBTQ+, being able to bring your whole self to work, that kind of thing, from two gay colleagues, one lesbian one gay. So far, so good - absolutely the right thing for my organisation to be doing. Then they got onto pronouns and how everyone should start every meeting asking what pronouns attendees want to have used and encouraging everyone to put them in our email sign-offs. I'm never going to do that, but I can already see it happening around the organisation (particularly the US, but some of the easily led/want to be noticed over here will soon follow suit).

My husband won't listen to me talk about this sort of stuff anymore - he agrees with me, but says that it is basically like someone saying they "don't agree with all that Black Lives Matter stuff". My best friend works with young people and whilst I've tried to approach it with her very gently, including all of the stats about single sex spaces and how women and children's safety is negatively affected as a result, her reaction is that she gets all of that but she works with children every day who are tortured by their own bodies.

I know that our concerns are justified, I know that women's safety/opportunities are going to be negatively affected but - if I'm completely honest with myself - I just can't see how we're going to stop it. Julie Bindel has a tweet pinned to her feed which is basically that the misogyny at the moment is like a tidal wave and that's how it feels.

I'm not sure why I'm writing this really - certainly not to bring anyone down but there's no-one I can speak to about this in real life. How do you even go about discussing these things when, in my work at least, it would probably get me fired and everyone around me in my personal life has either bought into the nonsense hook line and sinker, or just doesn't want to hear it?

OP posts:
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CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/07/2021 17:44

I've checked my hat - Ooh and indeed Arrrgh!

But you are a little early. World Speak Like a Pirate Day is in September.

Cos you couldn't have had a Godwin moment there, could you?

mollythemeerkat · 27/07/2021 17:42

It's about self reflection so how about you try it - I dont think self reflection is cheezecakes style somehow.

ArabellaScott · 27/07/2021 17:41

Who was broadcasting fantasies about holding knives to women's throats, terrorising them and making them scream for mercy?

It wasn't us.

Who was posting pictures on Twitter of guns and knives and threats?

It wasn't us.

Who has used bomb threats, attacked women, supported rapists being put in women's prisons, supported young people being sterilised, supported death threats for JK Rowling and women MPs, hung effigies of women in trees, worn T-shirts calling for death to women, carried signs calling for death to women, carried baseball bats wrapped in barbed wire, mocked women who died tragically young, wished death and torture on women on this site?

It wasn't us.

Check your own hat, mate.

Sonarl · 27/07/2021 17:34

Your friends and family likely think you're obsessed and bonkers

More and more comment every day - it's reaching the mainstream now - men at work, men in the pub and they're horrified.

We've always known it but, unfortunately, it's the men saying no that will kill the TRA agenda.

Imnobody4 · 27/07/2021 17:32

Cheezecake
The title of this thread is
Does anyone ever have a "are we the baddies" moment?*
It's about self reflection so how about you try it. Do you ever wonder if you're the baddie? Serious question - in the dark hours before the dawn, any doubts about sterilising children, putting sex offenders in women's jails, bullying anyone who disagrees with you, calling for them to be sacked. No qualms at all?

Deliriumoftheendless · 27/07/2021 17:32

Yes. Cheez thinks if you oppose women being housed with rapists, locked in a cell all night with them, if you don’t approve of barbed wire baseball bats, bomb threats, rape threats, smoke bombs or women being left to die because they can’t enter refuges anymore then according to Cheez you’re a nazi.

If your form of protest is a ribbon, or a sticker or a nuanced argument on a parenting website Cheez thinks you’re a nazi.

If you don’t want young women to lose sporting scholarships that raise them out of poverty Cheez thinks you’re the same as people who attempted genocide.

And every one of these posts will be ignored- just like the threads that evidence all those things because in the head of Cheez being a woman is basically the same as the most evil people in living memory.

Helleofabore · 27/07/2021 17:31

You are right Artichoke. No one could in reality accuse women of such a vile and horrific act if they actually thought about the reality. To make light of such a thing in such a way, to throw around such a label, would make some people absolutely on the wrong side of history.

RedDogsBeg · 27/07/2021 17:27

I've got a pair of pirate style boots somewhere....

ArabellaScott · 27/07/2021 17:26

I haven't seen Germaine Greer around for a while, has anyone checked if she's been invading Poland?

Helleofabore · 27/07/2021 17:24

Surely not Rufus?

Wouldn't that just be passe, really old trope and hyperbole? Surely our poster meant that we were pirates? I did have a really lovely ruffled shirt and waistcoat in the 90s. It was fab... the waistcoat I made my shelf.

I'd be disappointed that they merely resorted to that old vile fall back.

Artichokeleaves · 27/07/2021 17:23

Surely that can't be right, Rufus. No one could possibly be sufficiently naiive and crass to compare women refusing to hand over their rights without resistance to ghettos. The clearances of the ghettos. The absolute horror upon horror of transportation. The camps.

Not unless they knew absolutely nothing about. And had no idea of the absolute insult it offers to the voices and lives of millions of people who experienced things that most of us thankfully can't imagine in our worst nightmares.

RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 27/07/2021 17:23

@CardinalLolzy

Yeah it's a reference to the Mitchell & Webb sketch in the first line of the OP. I assume everyone's watched it?!
Nope
RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 27/07/2021 17:22

@Megasausagehead

Well they didn't specify, so pirate it is.
😀
CardinalLolzy · 27/07/2021 17:21

Yeah it's a reference to the Mitchell & Webb sketch in the first line of the OP. I assume everyone's watched it?!

Megasausagehead · 27/07/2021 17:21

Well they didn't specify, so pirate it is.

RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 27/07/2021 17:19

@Helleofabore

Check your hat, because it's probably got a skull on it.

I quite like the idea of being a bit of a pirate though.... are you SURE that was what you intended to say?

I wouldn’t get excited

Nazi caps have skulls on them….the poster is calling posters on this board nazis

RedDogsBeg · 27/07/2021 17:19

@FloralBunting

My hat is a very jaunty feminist pirate hat, so yes. The rest of that post was shite, though.
To de-rail slightly I recently read about female pirates, was very interesting.
ArabellaScott · 27/07/2021 17:19

Check your hat, because it's probably got a skull on it.

Ah-harrr! Jim-me-non-gender-specific-sidekick, where be the right-wing gold of yore?!

Waitwhat23 · 27/07/2021 17:18

And if I ever wavered, I would be able to refer to this www.terfisaslur.com

Pure, unadulterated, open hatred of women.

334bu · 27/07/2021 17:17

The real baddies are the people putting male sex offenders into female prisoners' cells.

Waitwhat23 · 27/07/2021 17:16

Nope. We're not the baddies.

We're not the ones making death and rape threats.

We're not the ones doxxing, deplatforming and getting people fired.

We're not the ones denying biological reality.

We are the ones discussing things and providing links to credible evidence instead of plopping or providing links to risible youtube videos.

Blueberry, we missed your take on the thread discussing women being raped in prison by transwomen prisoners - care to join the conversation? Or is that too difficult a stance to defend by screaming transphobe at everyone?

Helleofabore · 27/07/2021 17:12

You are the b!gots.

You might want to check your understanding of that word, and who is unable to cope with other views.

I always, always laugh when I see this. It is so clear that people posting that crap have just regurgitated it from some 'learned' person who they have outsourced their thinking to.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 27/07/2021 17:10

Sterilising children has never been on the right side of history.
Whether it’s been done for religious reasons, to make them more valuable as slaves, to give them lovely singing voices, or this latest iteration.
I am amazed by people who can’t see that.

Helleofabore · 27/07/2021 17:07

Check your hat, because it's probably got a skull on it.

I quite like the idea of being a bit of a pirate though.... are you SURE that was what you intended to say?

yourhairiswinterfire · 27/07/2021 17:05

I don't think vulnerable women locked up in prison should expect to be raped or sexually assaulted by males as part of their punishment because some braindead idiots have decided locking rapists up with them is a good idea.

I don't think young girls or women should have to encounter creeps with their erect penis out when they're in single sex spaces.

I think women fleeing domestic abuse are entitled to refuge away from males.

LGB people shouldn't face homophobic abuse from the ''community'' for being same-sex attracted instead of being attracted to gender stereotypes.

I don't think female athletes should be forced to play against males who have many biological advantages over them. Nor should women have their skulls split open because they're forced to fight a male. Nor should women lose places on the team because mediocre males want in.

I don't think women deserve to be threatened with rape, death, bombs, knives etc whenever we speak up for ourselves.

I don't think men should get to dictate to us what a woman is or isn't, redefining us to suit themselves.

If that makes me the devil, then so be it 🤷

Personally, I feel that the people who are happy to see women locked up with convicted rapists, who are happy for women to have their skulls split open or to be 'folded like deckchairs', who think abused women shouldn't be allowed refuge, who defund and vandalise rape crisis centres, who think rape, death, bomb and knife threats are acceptable, are the ones with a little bit of a problem...