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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Have things gone too far?

338 replies

Okbussitout · 25/02/2021 08:51

I saw a tiktok comment thread saying that if you wouldn't have sex with a trans person you're transphobic. My thinking on this is sexuality is quite complex. But for example I've had gay friends say to me they feel really grossed out by the opposite sex genitals) both gay men and women) so if someone has a penis but presents as a woman (this isn't an argument about passing) then it's transphobic not to be attracted to them because they have genitals of the opposite sex that you are attracted to. Primarily I'd say I'm straight and a big part of that is my enjoyment of my partner's penis. (sorry that statement is tmi and redic to type)

This got me thinking about gc argument on here. For the first time I was thinking this doesn't make logical sense. You can dress how you want, call yourself what you want, use the spaces you want, as actually I don't think most trans people are a threat. I'm happy for trans women to be women. But I feel trying to dictate who people have sex is too much.

I'm sort of musing, but also wonder if actually on both sides there is such adversity that there's no going back? With increasingly wild arguments on both sides. So how would there be a way forward from here?

I'm wondering if trans people are angry because they feel their bodies don't match their gender in their head. I've had on and of mental health issues so can imagine this feels awful. I'm also fat so know what it's like to be discriminated against. Maybe gc women are angry because they already feel ver discriminated against and are now told the rights we have are not needed. So yeah I just wonder if this debate is at a point with no way forward reasonable way forward. I'd like to know people's views on this.

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XDownwiththissortofthingX · 25/02/2021 09:29

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Except for I really haven't seen this

I have

Okbussitout · 25/02/2021 09:29

@SpongeBobJudgeyPants

I feel trans people are seen as a threat to women by them being in the same toilet when actually I'd say the overwhelming majority just wnat to pee How do you know this OP? And what do you suggest for the ones who don't just want to pee Hmm
I suppose this is the thing isn't it I don't. I'm not sure how easy it is to actually know this either way. We don't have the mind reading thing from minority report where we know pre crim intentions!

But also I'm trying to have a non accusatory conversation about this and we are just a few comments in but already seem to be getting adversarial. Which I really don't think I've brought in my tone. As if I have I need to review how I email at work!

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Theunamedcat · 25/02/2021 09:26

Lesbians with female penis verbally berating lesbians who do not want to sleep with a person with a penis is a nasty side to all this if your same sex attracted you should not be coerced into changing

I've no personal experience about this happening with gay men

YetAnotherSpartacus · 25/02/2021 09:22

The idea that people are being phobic because of sexual preference isn't a mainstream or widely held view, even among trans rights activists, so it doesn't really help with credibility when you attack all trans activists as if they all subscribe to and unquestioningly accept this view

Except for I really haven't seen this.

SpongeBobJudgeyPants · 25/02/2021 09:21

I feel trans people are seen as a threat to women by them being in the same toilet when actually I'd say the overwhelming majority just wnat to pee How do you know this OP? And what do you suggest for the ones who don't just want to pee Hmm

Endofthelinefinally · 25/02/2021 09:20

We got to the just wanting to pee comment in record time.

EyesOpening · 25/02/2021 09:20

There are lots of people who I wouldn’t have sex with, that doesn’t make my phobic of whatever thing someone has decided is the reason.
I also remember reading that “your love is not unconditional if the genitals aren’t those you expected” (or words to that effect) - my love for someone isn’t unconditional anyway, there are lots of things I might find out that would be a dealbreaker!

Okbussitout · 25/02/2021 09:15

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

There are extreme positions on all sides. I think the problem is that people on either side are now latching on to some of the more outlandish and ridiculous statements and views, and then acting like every single person on the opposite side of the argument subscribes to these views and opinions, when that simply isn't the case.

The idea that people are being phobic because of sexual preference isn't a mainstream or widely held view, even among trans rights activists, so it doesn't really help with credibility when you attack all trans activists as if they all subscribe to and unquestioningly accept this view.

The same in the other direction of course.

Oh I'm definitely not attacking trans right activists as if they all believe this. I'm actually not attacking anyone come to think of it. This was an example from the trans rights side. But equally I've read things here where I feel trans people are seen as a threat to women by them being in the same toilet when actually I'd say the overwhelming majority just wnat to pee.
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Sophoclesthefox · 25/02/2021 09:15

I don’t honestly quite know how understanding that humans are sexually dimorphic has come to be seen as an extreme view. It’s not an adversarial position, it’s just reality.

OvaHere · 25/02/2021 09:10

Of course things have gone too far. We're living in a new religious dystopia with blasphemy laws where you run the risk of being fired or arrested if you acknowledge reality. Especially if you're a woman.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 25/02/2021 08:59

There are extreme positions on all sides. I think the problem is that people on either side are now latching on to some of the more outlandish and ridiculous statements and views, and then acting like every single person on the opposite side of the argument subscribes to these views and opinions, when that simply isn't the case.

The idea that people are being phobic because of sexual preference isn't a mainstream or widely held view, even among trans rights activists, so it doesn't really help with credibility when you attack all trans activists as if they all subscribe to and unquestioningly accept this view.

The same in the other direction of course.

Endofthelinefinally · 25/02/2021 08:53

Have you read anything else on this board OP?
You will find it very interesting and informative.

Okbussitout · 25/02/2021 08:52

Sorry this post is a bit rambling!

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