Page 13 | Fair Cop Court of Appeal 8-10 March

Spero · 2021-02-17T10:49:00+00:00

Please save the date! This is such an important hearing for freedom of speech, particularly around the issues of sex and gender. The hearing will be for 1 1/2 days some time between 8-10 March, we don't have an exact listing yet. Hopefully there will be some live tweeting. Do support if you can. [[https://twitter.com/WeAreFairCop/status/1361820204649639951?s=20]]

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 09/03/2021 17:33

Outed
When MOJ stats show that a disproportionate number of TW in the prison estate have been convicted of sex offences it’s reasonable to assume that some violent pervs will pretend to be trans to get access to women.
That is very different from saying Trans people are a threat. Violent Pervs are a threat no matter how they identify trans or not trans.

Ninkanink · 09/03/2021 17:33

@outedbyfaircop for you, that would have been such a truly horrendous thing to go through. Wishing you all well.

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 17:30

@ArabellaScott

I am very sorry to hear your child ran away, tho, outed. Hope all is better, now and you are both safe and well.

thanks Arabella, thankfully a change of education setting and additional cahms support has worked wonders, but nearly every parent of teens I know says their child is struggling with their mental health in one way or another. lockdown has been absolutely terrible for kids' mental health, I really think we are looking at a time bomb.

Soontobe60 · 09/03/2021 17:30

@outedbyfaircop

well that's weird, because there are threads and threads on here extrapolating that trans people are all violent narcissistic pervs because of the things that 'specific individuals' have done and said.

That just isn’t true. If you believe it is, you're going to have to provide links. I’m sorry that your family had to go through what happened, with your child going missing. I have been in your position except my child did not claim to be trans. Its every parent’s worst nightmare. I think its hard for parents a without a trans child to accept that you didn’t think presenting the facts about your child was more important that affirming their gender identity. Yes, when someone goes missing, an accurate physical description is important, and if your child looks like a boy then that should be made clear. But to ignore their material biology in such a situation? Thats hard to understand.

midgedude · 09/03/2021 17:29

Correction ....there are endless posts from people claiming that everyone is saying that trans people are ...

There are also a fair number of posts that state that an alarming proportion of men commit various offences against women

Try to read more carefully.

BeanieSue · 09/03/2021 17:29

@outedbyfaircop

well that's weird, because there are threads and threads on here extrapolating that trans people are all violent narcissistic pervs because of the things that 'specific individuals' have done and said.

I don't think there have been any threads that extrapolate that. No one has said that all trans people are violent narcissistic pervs. The actions of specific individuals are used to show that there could be an impact on woman and girls and the specific spaces and services created for them - as these actions of specific individuals did have an impact at that time on others. It is not unrealistic to assume that such actions by some individuals could happen again.

CardinalLolzy · 09/03/2021 17:27

Hope your child is fine and doing well outed

Didn't see anything about specific children in the live tweeting about the case but I admit it went a bit fast for me.

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 17:25

@nauticant

Provide a screenshot showing that and you might have a point.

the two threads on here about Elliott page's divorce were awash with it, yet they were both deleted. I wonder why a Hollywood actor getting a (apparently all very amicable) divorce was considered a FWR issue? and I wonder why both threads would have been deleted, if there's never any transphobia here?

ArabellaScott · 09/03/2021 17:24

I am very sorry to hear your child ran away, tho, outed. Hope all is better, now and you are both safe and well.

CardinalLolzy · 09/03/2021 17:23

@Evarish

In light of We Are Fair Cop and Sarah Philimore specifically comparing LGBTQ+ people to Nazi's and telling a Jewish man he was responsible for the next Holocaust to the shame of his murdered family, is this still what you support?

I wonder if "comparing groups of people to Nazis" is something you condemn regardless of who does it? As I have some interesting examples...

nauticant · 09/03/2021 17:18

That was to outedbyfaircop.

nauticant · 09/03/2021 17:17

Provide a screenshot showing that and you might have a point.

Original poster

Spero · 09/03/2021 17:17

I am hoping the arguments on the irrationality of the guidance and the impossibility of forseeing if someone will complain will be strong enough.

I thjnk the argument about the common law was a mistake. Dull and irrelevant and annoyed judges. Some good points made but could have been much more focused and punchier.

Judges did at least seem to get the point that the chilling effect of freedom of speech is the fear of being recorded - that's what the Turkish case found.

Let's just hope the CoP are as lacklustre as they were last time .

OP posts:

ArabellaScott · 09/03/2021 17:17

Sorry, Ninkanink, I wasn't quoting you! I was responding to the person below you.

ArabellaScott · 09/03/2021 17:16

@Ninkanink

This is not about specific individuals nor about agreeing with everything they might do or say. This is about overarching principles, which are hugely important.

You're making some wild accusations there. Evidence?

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 17:14

well that's weird, because there are threads and threads on here extrapolating that trans people are all violent narcissistic pervs because of the things that 'specific individuals' have done and said.

Ninkanink · 09/03/2021 17:08

This is not about specific individuals nor about agreeing with everything they might do or say. This is about overarching principles, which are hugely important.

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 17:08

my child passes everywhere he goes. he has been addressed and perceived as a boy by randoms since long before he came out as trans. as his mother, I obviously know this better than some gutless cunt who gets their thrills kicking a family when we were down. and obviously when he went missing, I weighed up how to formulate the description of him so as to ensure the quickest and easiest way to get people to spot him, with his best interests at heart because I am his mother. But you carry on with your narrative that all parents of trans kids are neglectful idiots. the thing about sunlight is, it shines on everything.

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 17:03

when your "intelligence" comes from a transphobe who hasn't even got the guts to talk to me directly, it's actually just gossip and bitching.

Tibtom · 09/03/2021 16:57

[quote Numicon]@outedbyfaircop so, you didn't give critical information about a missing child for ideological reasons!? My god, I'm stunned tbh.[/quote]
Horrifying!

outedbyfaircop · 09/03/2021 16:56

[quote Numicon]@outedbyfaircop so, you didn't give critical information about a missing child for ideological reasons!? My god, I'm stunned tbh.[/quote]
no, my child looks like a boy. had I reported a missing girl, no one would have recognised him. because he looks like a boy. but nice try at suggesting I would purposely endanger my own child. weirdly, I know better than some random twitter hate account what my own kid looks like. his photos look like a boy. even fair cop admitted that his photos look like a boy, but apparently standing facing the camera is 'posing' and changes what you 'really' look like, who knew. the only people who endangered this child are the people who ) outed him publicly as trans b) circulated a misleading description of his appearance c) repeatedly misgendered him on twitter during a time he was already having a massive mental health crisis and d) encouraged ghoulish and distressing speculation about whatever grisly fate he may have met.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 09/03/2021 16:46

It’s quite a technical appeal. My reading of the tweets is does the automatic recording of these incidents without any form of investigation or screening leads to a restriction on free speech. Someone could find themselves with an incident recorded because of a vexatious (or bonkers) complaint.
Article 10 allows for freedom of expression but knowing you risk having an incident reported may lead to self censorship.

Numicon · 09/03/2021 16:21

@outedbyfaircop so, you didn't give critical information about a missing child for ideological reasons!? My god, I'm stunned tbh.

nauticant · 09/03/2021 16:07

I was surprised (not judge-level surprised) at the Court of Appeal judges being apparently unconcerned about the gathering of uninvestigated complaints about members of the public, which could be frivolous, malicious, etc which down the line could have adverse consequences for members of the public.

Maybe in the CoA judges play the game with much more of a poker face.

ArabellaScott · 09/03/2021 15:59

It's being livetweeted here, too

twitter.com/WeAreFairCop

I've missed it all, too busy with the FPFW /ONS case