Friends dd has just come out as agender

Has the ‘pronouns in space’ thread just been deleted? Because of what Barracker said? Crikey, sometimes it really feels like 1950s Eastern Europe round here ...

I do not care what I call a person other than it is what they want .. Abigail, Tom or x whatever. I do not care what anyone identifies as or who they shag. As long as they are a consenting adult Happy is as happy does. However I only wish to share a personal change or toilet space with an xx chromosome person on individual who no longer has xy genitalia

I wouldn’t worry too much about this. It’s pretty easy when referring to your friend’s DD to just use their name. Don’t get drawn into battle anywhere it’s wasted energy is my philosophy.

I’d agree with the ‘I consider myself agender too’ thing. Not because it will horrify the teen (although it definitely will) but because it’s a pragmatic decision if gender is under discussion- I don’t really believe in it at all therefore I am agender, I do not have a gender.

I think most of us are agender and I'd share that info as this is not a way to be special any more than we all are. But I'd use the pronouns 'she' wants. It's grating but not the biggest deal. Probably would divert to calling her by her name more than using pronouns TBH as I'm old and my brain can't easily learn new languages.

It is hard enough to remember names. Why should I have to try and remember which individuals want me to ignore established rules of language when they're not even present and try and remember what particular letter combination they insist upon? Especially when my conversation partner may not know who I am referring to and what their preferred made up pronouns are? Doing so reduces comprehension and understanding.

I'm more anti-gender than agender. As in fuck gender! Bring back sex!

"I have a similar situation with a friend, and I use their chosen pronouns because I treat it as a matter of common courtesy to address people as they wish to be addressed."
If I'm using a pronoun about someone, then I am talking about them, not to them. They're not there. If they were there, I'd be using their name or 'you'. And since they're not there, I cannot 'address' them.

So that reduces using the words that they want me to use when they're not there to hear me use those words - to compelled speech. Compelled speech is not common courtesy. Indeed, it's deeply discourteous of them to attempt to compel my speech.

Gosh so as a teenage Goth it could have gone arseways? I'm still mostly goth but am female and have always been.

[quote Fieldofyellowflowers]@LunaHeather I agree. Gender stereotypes should be ignored. I suppose that's harder for teenagers with a tendency to overthink though.[/quote]
I think it's harder because teens are now faced with/taught by academics whose raison d'etre is to inflame.

I used to have respect for academia but no longer. The goal seems to be "seek attention, cause trouble" and teens are really getting the brunt of it.

What is agender? Can someone tell me please!

I find it all a bit worrying but try to be matter of fact when DD12 talks about not identifying as a boy or a girl & that we need to use different pronouns to refer to her. She started secondary school in September & when we spoke to the staff about how she was getting on, their only concern was a rather full on friendship with a girl who is going through the transgender process ( having counselling etc). I think it’s just a phase.

@LunaHeather I agree. Gender stereotypes should be ignored. I suppose that's harder for teenagers with a tendency to overthink though.

[quote Fieldofyellowflowers]@LunaHeather

Not everyone thinks the same way as you. That was just an example as well. My initial point was that gender stereotypes are too bloody strict sometimes and it is no wonder some kids start questioning whether they are one, the other or neither.[/quote]
Yes
Gender stereotypes are ridiculous

I don't understand how we ended up here instead of just ignoring them.

I think using the preferred name but not the pronouns is a good compromise, especially in an environment where you can't get sacked.

The use of sexed pronouns is part of the English language. The request for alternative pronouns imposes an additional cognitive load, which, frankly, a 16-year old shouldn't be asking for. Endless pandering will only prolong adolescence, sometimes a metaphorical bucket of cold water over the head is the kindest thing you can do to a sensitive person.

I'd also tell her that many gender-critical feminists are 'agender', that it's sensible to think there are better things to do with your time than obsess about 'gender' but that it's not necessary to change pronouns to signal this important process of reflection to the rest of the world.

@LunaHeather

Not everyone thinks the same way as you. That was just an example as well. My initial point was that gender stereotypes are too bloody strict sometimes and it is no wonder some kids start questioning whether they are one, the other or neither.

You can take pandering to children too far.

Boy George and Marilyn knew/know they are men.

That reasoning doesn't wash.

She'll learn. She'll grow up eventually.

"Agender?".

I'm agog.

I have spoken candidly with their parents (who wanted to ask for my opinion) saying I think it is a load of bullshit. But not to the child who is already very emotionally sensitive as that is not my place

Same here (i just spoke to the mother who asked my opinion BEFORE she told me about the child)

I don't think your attitude, OP, will do anything other than confirm the agender teenager's idea that everyone over 30 has one foot in the grave.