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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Evan Rachel Wood - and companies rushing to drop Manson

69 replies

MedusasBadHairDay · 02/02/2021 13:51

Anyone else finding it interesting how Manson's record label, and 2 TV shows have dropped him so fast after Evan Rachel Wood and others named him as an abuser?

Usually companies wait a while to see if it all blows over, but they've barely hesitated. On the one hand, that's great they are taking the women seriously and believing them. But to me it also suggests that they know enough about him to have absolutely no doubts - which begs the question of why were they working with him in the first place? Given a lot of his awful behaviour was well known, why did it take them this long?

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donquixotedelamancha · 03/02/2021 15:37

Wotapallaver do you have another name, and research into sex cults?

If the answer to this question is 'no' then I hope they are both single.

MedusasBadHairDay · 03/02/2021 15:36

@Glittertwins

I had his autobiography and was a huge fan when they appeared late 90s. I thought that his book was sick and disturbing at the time even compared to some of the other antics that rock bands got up to.
I remember people treating the book as a work of fiction, "oh he hasn't really done all that, he's just playing up to his character, he's trying to shock/outrage"
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Wotapolava · 03/02/2021 15:34

Thanks for your opinions.

Glittertwins · 03/02/2021 15:34

I had his autobiography and was a huge fan when they appeared late 90s. I thought that his book was sick and disturbing at the time even compared to some of the other antics that rock bands got up to.

picklemewalnuts · 03/02/2021 15:23

Wotapallaver do you have another name, and research into sex cults?
I'm finding your posts hard to follow, I think because you know what you are thinking but I don't.

Respectabitch · 03/02/2021 15:22

@Wotapolava er... What?

Putting this as politely and constructively as possible, your posts really make no sense, and don't seem to have anything to do with ERW or MM. About all I can make out is that you think people in power are getting away with... something.

Wotapolava · 03/02/2021 15:16

Is it going to court?
Let's wait and see.

I'm getting notifications for replies, when I look here, there isn't one.

Technical issues?

MadameButterface · 03/02/2021 14:25

“ People blaming Evan Rachel Wood and the other women for their treatment at his hands seem to be implying that people who look like MM (gothy weirdos) are all violent to their partners, which is categorically not the case at all. ”

Exactly this. It’s the opposite side of the ‘but he seems like such a nice guy’ coin, and it plays into the damaging myth that abusers are monsters, easy to spot etc, rather than just potentially any normal random guy.

Some abusers hide it in plain sight making out like they’re edgy iconoclasts

Some abusers are outwardly lovely men that no one has a bad word to say about

Abusers can be anyone, and so can their victims

SoCrimeaRiver · 03/02/2021 14:13

@MedusasBadHairDay I'd agree. She seems a very private and classy lady. I'd be horrified to learn she's been a victim of his too.

MedusasBadHairDay · 03/02/2021 13:59

@SoCrimeaRiver

I'm wondering how long he's been acting like this. Dita Von Tease, for example, I couldn't imagine being with someone who treated her like this, but they split up some years ago. I'm trying to remember who was the bigger star between them; I suspect him and her star came into ascendancy during their marriage.
I've heard some stuff that suggests Dita was also a victim of his, though she's a really private person so I don't imagine she'll ever open up about it. And I remember how his fans went for her when she left him, if I remember right he didn't discourage this - possibly encouraged it.

I've had the pleasure of speaking to hDitaer both in person (very briefly at a book signing) and over email, and she is an absolute sweetheart. So hope she's not being hounded by the press over this.

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SoCrimeaRiver · 03/02/2021 13:47

I'm wondering how long he's been acting like this. Dita Von Tease, for example, I couldn't imagine being with someone who treated her like this, but they split up some years ago. I'm trying to remember who was the bigger star between them; I suspect him and her star came into ascendancy during their marriage.

treefox3513 · 03/02/2021 13:42

@Lammergeier I have read his autobiography and I don't recall rape or abuse?
It must be a good 15 years since I read it though

MedusasBadHairDay · 03/02/2021 13:41

If that is what happened.

Some of it he has spoken about openly, plus even now more women have come forward, it's up to 7 now. It happened.

I could talk for hours on this but I won't.

Well that's a relief. Especially as I'm still not sure what "this" actually is.

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Wotapolava · 03/02/2021 13:35

MedusaBadHairDay,

If that is what happened.

Privacy is treated differently in the USA as opposed to here.

Some people get caught - others don't.
Privacy issues centre with the media too.
Gossip is the bread and butter of media and they do all they can to get the maximum effect for PI or financial gain - if criminality involved also.
And as for the media claiming to hold power to account? How long has it taken to get the truth on Phone-hacking etc?
Why are we seeing another inquiry into The Princess of Wales death?
Unfinished business - and a lot of it. Holding people to ransome is not in their favour - nor should it be. When they don't put it out overtly - it goes covertly and a lot of people are dying around the media.
I could talk for hours on this but I won't.
The problem in the UK (and it is a big problem) is how full control lies with central government.
That needs to change.
I can tell you that is how it stands.
I can tell you there is a push for change (I am pushing harder than anyone).
I can tell you what I know (that others don't)
I can't present all evidence.
I do know who can.

It is what it is
The truth is the truth
The end will be how it was predicted or planned.
Upper echelons have known for a long time what is going on.

The media went too far and the blame lies with them. Try as they might to find a nice little way out because state funding is the only secure future if subscription fails.
They can lash out as much as they want - it just provides more evidence for future demise.
Firstly, they have to fire into their own ranks.
What happened to the story on Google finances?

My views cannot be altered.

This pandemic is no doubt overshadowing a lot.
I won't be letting go in that fight.

I don't look at this story and see a potential case for criminal proceedings - I see a lot more .

I don't have an agenda nor coerced by anybody.
However, when pulled into a difficult situation, I can't take the choice to do nothing.

People die fighting for what they believe in without decent recognition - that is hard to see and take.
It isn't about taking sides.
It never was.

MoltenLasagne · 03/02/2021 13:24

I don't get how he is just being dropped either. I'm the least hooked into celebrity news of anyone and I thought this had been confirmed years ago. In my head Marilyn Manson = Abuser.

DragonBlu · 03/02/2021 13:07

m.youtube.com/watch?v=cobhBZmiihU

m.youtube.com/watch?v=WUtPTTHpOec

mansonisabusive Instagram

MMansonAbuse Twitter

Lammergeier · 03/02/2021 12:37

If you don't want to be accused of abusing your partners... don't abuse your partners.

The naming of his band isn't a red flag for me- it's very common in the metal/ alt-rock scene as mentioned before.

People blaming Evan Rachel Wood and the other women for their treatment at his hands seem to be implying that people who look like MM (gothy weirdos) are all violent to their partners, which is categorically not the case at all.

MM is not a very talented singer or musician. What he was extremely good at in the late 90s and early 2000s, was self-publicity and showmanship. When his band first emerged, the Satanic Panic was still fresh in people's memories and lots of people were genuinely terrified of MM because of the content of the music, his association with the Church of Satan and his stage shows. It was an extremely calculated move (MM was a music journo before he was a frontman).

He has never hidden what a shit he was to women, people chose to overlook it or excuse it because as part of his 'dangerous' image. I'm amazed it's taken this long for him to get Me Too'd.

MedusasBadHairDay · 03/02/2021 12:20

I'll be honest, I struggled with that reply.. I'm not sure what point was being made?

But the bit about "One question people should ask - what would you do if it was you In MM position?"

I mean, surely the answer is not abuse women in the first place?? 🤨

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Wotapolava · 03/02/2021 11:47

I have not paid any real attention to this case.
I do find it quite telling how Prince Andrew was the only name revealed in the Epstein scandal.
It is the US so these things are allowed to be put in public before legal course. Not in the UK - although the British press do run the stories.

One question people should ask - what would you do if it was you In MM position?

As for the BBC scandal that was or wasn't, it should make people think.

Just looking at the threads on here about affairs/adultery for instance allow for a comparison to be made - because it all centres around the same subject.

Perspective (not blame) is sometimes everything:

If a 13 year-old goes with a 17/18 year-old (not yet an adult in terms of the law) they risk going on a sex offender register. Even with consent and no harm

A marriage and family can be torn apart by affairs, yet such conduct is normalised as acceptable in law and the divorce then becomes about finances and possessions - not children.

Another perspective ( perspective, not blame) is to consider the damage done by officials in regards to misconduct in public office which carries a maximum life imprisonment tariff.
How many people have been given that sentence?

Zero.

Protected to the hilt while the standards are set which don't apply to them. How can anything improve?

I suppose a dead nurse at the hands of a police officer through a force who have been a cause for concern for years is not taken seriously. Officers slipping in and out of forces no questions asked.

I could go on and on about other issues there but that is in my blog where I have more to write.

Has anyone here claimed benefits?
You will know the levels of privacy information they ask.
We are legally required to give it. Officials, don't have to answer serious concerns?
Unfortunately there are some very sick people who would rather you suffer than them.

Such misconduct gets excused as personal and no-ones business. Or a counter claim as possibly vexatious. Sure we all make mistakes but we aren't sat where you are. A fundamental difference.

As I said to somebody recently, you can't look outwards until you look inwards.
As for anyone wanting to be taken seriously and be seen as sincere in any trusted position - it starts with your personal behaviour and attitude to it.
It is one thing to make a mistake but to then abuse power in cover up and use bullying, intimidation to silence complainers - is evil and does great harm to trust and peoples MH. You can't behave like that and expect others to trust you.
Look at the caliber of current PM - moreover, look to those who support him but wouldn't approve of his behaviours in others.

It isn't the people going to jail that are the real cause for concern but those who AREN'T!

There are people who are probably scared right now, don't be. Unless you are a mass murderer or total lost cause for help, there is always a bigger deck out there than you. You just need to find the argument for it.

I don't need approval or verification on my views because my own experiences entitle me to hold them.

I have no time for people who stand in my way. You have nothing of decency to gain.

MedusasBadHairDay · 03/02/2021 10:47

@newyearnewname123

I didn't know anything about him at all, apart from being named after a cult leader who encouraged others to commit murder. That was enough to put me off.
Yeah that's not unusual in the alternative/rock/metal scenes, so wouldn't be a red flag to me.

On that note I've seen a few comments on twitter about having no sympathy for ERW and the other women, because they apparently should have assumed they'd get that sort of treatment from someone who dresses like him.

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MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 03/02/2021 09:23

@newyearnewname123

I didn't know anything about him at all, apart from being named after a cult leader who encouraged others to commit murder. That was enough to put me off.
But, again, that is hiding in plain sight, because it is not unusual for bands/musicians to name themselves after offensive/horrible things - Iron Maiden, Joy Division etc.
newyearnewname123 · 03/02/2021 07:30

I didn't know anything about him at all, apart from being named after a cult leader who encouraged others to commit murder. That was enough to put me off.

MedusasBadHairDay · 02/02/2021 22:54

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow

He's done a Savile - using superficial, performative weirdness as a cover for actual deviancy.
Yep, he really has.
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SweatyBetty20 · 02/02/2021 22:26

I remember an interview with him talking about owning a “dildo-cam” so he could look inside his wife - ugh. He’s disgusting on every level.