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Original poster

The new Labour Trans Equality group is asking for help in defining transphobia - maybe your would like to help them?

39 replies

stumbledin · 01/02/2021 19:40

As a struggling new group - Labour Trans Equality (LTE) - is asking for help in defining transphobia so that it can be agreed across the Labour Party and affiliated groups.

I am sure many mumsnetters will be able to offer them advice on ensuring that the Equality part - ie equality being equal for all - is properly defined.

labourtransequality.org.uk/the-definition-of-transphobia/

OP posts:
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Whatsnewpussyhat · 02/02/2021 09:58

Talking about trans people in a negative manner at any time

Does that include sex offenders calling themselves women? Can't prove they aren't trans because if they say they are they must be believed.

DickKerrLadies · 02/02/2021 08:07

Bearing in mind that there's no definition of trans given, I have to look to Stonewall for a definition. Stonewall say I'm trans and I reckon a good chunk of us here fall under that definition so when people talk about us in a negative manner that's classed as transphobia? Every definition I've ever seen of non-binary applies to me (although TBF, it is very very wide).

But I've been around this discussion long enough to know that believing that sex is real and cannot be changed is enough to write you off as a transphobe, no matter how you identify. Even actual dysphoria-suffering transsexual males aren't allowed to stray from accepted dogma, there's no way females are allowed to have wrongthink too.

newyearnewname123 · 02/02/2021 08:05

Ha, mum of girls, thinking along the same lines!

newyearnewname123 · 02/02/2021 08:04

Can we have the not mocking people about clothes be extended to women?

I should definitely define myself as non-binary and then I would be able to tell my daughter my outfits are not to be mocked. Hmm

Mumofgirlswholiketoplaywithmud · 02/02/2021 07:16

Talking about trans people in a negative manner at any time

Can I come out as non-binary agenda so that noone can talk about me negatively ever again?

AnyOldPrion · 02/02/2021 06:54

Can we have the not mocking people about clothes be extended to women? Or must trans people once again be treated differently? These rules really are quite contradictory!

CranberriesChoccyAgain · 02/02/2021 05:50

"5. Mocking trans people because of the way they dress, or talk is transphobic."

Looks like Eddie Izzard has found his way to the suggestion box.

Really though? That's pretty snowflakey.

WeeBisom · 01/02/2021 23:52

This is my favourite provision, because it's a paradox:

"Talking about trans people in a negative manner at any time or treating trans people any differently from those who are not trans is transphobic."

So you can't talk about trans people in a negative manner AT ANY TIME, and you also can't treat trans people any differently from those who are not trans.
But what if you talk about non trans people in a negative manner? If you don't talk about trans people in a negative manner then you are treating them differently from non trans people. But if you do talk about trans people in a negative manner, then you are violating the rule that you can't talk about trans people in a negative manner at any point!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/02/2021 23:47

It keeps growing but the transphobic dogs are still my favourite

Always had a soft spot for that dog.

Mumofgirlswholiketoplaywithmud · 01/02/2021 23:38

*kidney function

Oh for an edit button

Mumofgirlswholiketoplaywithmud · 01/02/2021 23:38

Will they define trans?

And can we start using the term "self-identity essentialists". If they say self-identity is all it is.

Mumofgirlswholiketoplaywithmud · 01/02/2021 23:36

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

**Deliberately misgendering trans people at any time by calling trans women, “men” or trans men “women”, or non-binary people “men” or “women” is transphobic. **

So, accurately sexing someone is transphobic?

That explains why I got into trouble at work for discussing a patient who was male but identified as female. Their male sex was relevant to their health issue, I had to seek advice about part of their treatment plan, but, a colleague said I was transphobic for...well...talking about her prostate that was giving her gyp.

It's insane.

At least you weren't trying to calculate the eGFR/ kidney of a transman and having to use the adjustment for their biological sex (I saw a real life example in an article of a transman who had renal failure missed because the male equation was used)

Biology is clearly transphobic

Mumofgirlswholiketoplaywithmud · 01/02/2021 23:33

"Labour Party members should not like or share posts which are transphobic or discriminatory. If in any doubt seek advice and guidance."

And transphobic has already been defined as suggesting that there is a conflict of rights

So... Basically they just want to burn witches on social media who talk about women's rights. Glad I already cancelled my membership.

StillWeRise · 01/02/2021 23:31

mmm, maybe they should be asking themselves why it was so easy, like pushing at an open door, could it be that established power structures were only too pleased to see a way to further entrench themselves whilst at the same time seeming daring and radical?

Original poster
stumbledin · 01/02/2021 23:23

Founding Sponsors of Labour Trans Equality

The Founding sponsors who are drawn from CLPs across the country, are Emily Brothers, Heather Herbert, Suzanna Hopwood, Dr Natacha Kennedy, Cllr Anwen Muston, Cllr Osh Gantly, Dr Heather Peto, Astrid Walker.

labourtransequality.org.uk/labour-trans-equality/

Sometimes it feels like those who first started down the route of trans rights never actually thought they would get as far as they have, it total capture of institutions and main stream media.

And they realise they dont want to be part of the establishment so they have had to dream up a more extreme position, otherwise how will they be able to portray themselves as matyrs.

And of course and ingrained disposition to want to grind women's rights into the mud.

OP posts:
Rubidium · 01/02/2021 22:24

Does this have anything to do with Heather Peto resigning from LGBT+ Labour, because Peto was excluded from important decisions by “cisgender officers [who] thought they knew more about transgender issues […] than I did”.

uk.news.yahoo.com/first-ever-trans-lgbt-labour-172806676.html

i.e. LGBT+ Labour is transphobic.

YouJustDoYou · 01/02/2021 22:01

Saying a mother give a birth...

CuriousaboutSamphire · 01/02/2021 22:00

Thanks. I'll have a look in the morning.

I might even start a thread on Site Stuff about clicky links 😊

Whatsnewpussyhat · 01/02/2021 21:59

I understand dysphoria and wanting to change appearance etc, but people who don't change a thing but say they are non binary, what does that achieve the females will still get treated as shit as any other females.

Abitofalark · 01/02/2021 21:44

Is this what you want? Hope it works

labourtransequality.org.uk/the-definition-of-transphobia/

CuriousaboutSamphire · 01/02/2021 21:30

Can someone repeat the link please? My phone didn't like the original... 😊

zanahoria · 01/02/2021 21:29

haha wow that 133 itemised list above is something to behold

It keeps growing but the transphobic dogs are still my favourite

CuriousaboutSamphire · 01/02/2021 21:24

Ooh! Just an idea.

When they have finished can we all re-join and start a new Women's group?

We can take their list, change trans anything for women and girls and publish that too.

Make Keir earn his money....

EvenleyWitch · 01/02/2021 21:22

why does this even need its own set of rules and dictats? Cant we just treat trans people according to the same rules that governs hate speech towards religion, ethnicity and sexuality that aready exist?

Why do trans groups need a whole heap of extra 'you must nots' added in to the equation that no other minority group gets?

Surely ts not rocket science or am i missing something?

EvenleyWitch · 01/02/2021 21:16

“Claiming there is conflict between trans peoples rights and women’s rights or other communities rights is transphobic”

So, If Im a woman and feel my rights are in conflict with another group of people (and they after all my rights, so i should know how i feel about them) im being warned inadvance to shut up because saying Im worried is classed as phobic and the other group's rights are more important than mine anyway.

..Ok, Gotcha.