Humza Yousaf and Scottish Hate Crime Bill

Ok griefmonster.

Thanks

I see my mp was dismayed by this

A feminism that recognises our shared challenges while valuing our differences.

But it doesn't. It doesn't recognise female challenges or value female anything at all, it just barges female completely out of womanhood altogether and makes it entirely about males and male gender choices. We're not even allowed the word 'woman' any more, and 'female' and 'lesbian' are regarded as hate speech.

There is no way forward with this. It's been tried. It would seem to me to have been proven now beyond all doubt: females need boundaries from males because in mixed sex situations males will dominate to the exclusion and harm of females. There's no reciprocal respect or care. From what has been seen so far: males will not play fair in this or do their share of the work for mutual inclusion, they don't give or reciprocate to the female side of womanhood, they just expect and take. The evidence is very ample at this point: this does not involve male born self identified people giving one flying fuck about females and their voices and their needs, or what they destroy for females in the process, and female voices are daily shouted down with derision and threats of sexual violence when they try to speak their experiences and needs. Prove me wrong. Please. Show me the evidence that there is anything in this for females other than noble self sacrifice.

Which makes these lovely values just a load of enabling, female harming and sentimental bullshit. Face the bloody facts Leanne for pete's sake.

Their former leader Leanne Wood is an ex Women's Aid worker & social worker, and a champion of male-inclusive feminism:
"I want to see an inclusive feminism which brings women together rather than dividing us. A feminism that recognises our shared challenges while valuing our differences. A feminism that understands that gender is a complex and deeply personal thing, and is about so much more than outdated ideas of biology." 2018 statement.

Wow just wow. If ever you needed another reason to not vote for nationalists...there it is.

You are right Whatsnew. And Wales seem hellbent on following Scotland's lead.

Luckily we have far fewer devolved powers but the stealth version of self-ID is well underway and the Welsh Government (Labour) are totally captured.

If Plaid from a coalition after the next elections, as looks likely, the situation will worsen. Plaid's leader Adam Price is a committed TWAW advocate and the membership include a significant number of anti-women activists (cf www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4103049-Support-Plaid-Cymru-MP-Helen-Mary-Jones).

Their former leader Leanne Wood is an ex Women's Aid worker & social worker, and a champion of male-inclusive feminism:
"I want to see an inclusive feminism which brings women together rather than dividing us. A feminism that recognises our shared challenges while valuing our differences. A feminism that understands that gender is a complex and deeply personal thing, and is about so much more than outdated ideas of biology." 2018 statement.

No it isn't. The Law Commission were looking at similar proposals recently for E&W.

England isn't safe from this shit though. We've just bought more time with Labour being voted out because of Brexit.

@YouSetTheTone are you in England?

This makes me want to support IndyRef and for Scotland to separate from the rest of the U.K. and get these scary toxic politics away from here. Truly depressing. I love(d) Scotland and went to university there but I can’t abide what it’s becoming.

I have written to my reps. I've had the most arrogant shite back from the SNP MSP. And high-handed pish from the Green.

I'm not really inclined to keep writing to them, tbh. If they don't see the issues by now they are clearly unable to grasp basic logic and I doubt I will be able to persuade them.

@Whatsnewpussyhat I understand the concern but that's why lobbying your representatives now before the election is so important. All parties need to know more fly there is a decent groundswell of opinion that is actively engaged and will vote on this issue. Might help change some minds. Better than an invisible vote at a general election where the loss of votes might not make an impact against all the other issues people could be voting on.

From forewoman

www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-snp-was-wrong-to-back-down-to-the-transgender-mob

Whatsnewpussyhatthey can't. It needs to be passed by a majority of MSPs. That's representative democracy

That doesn't really give me much hope tbh

@Whatsnewpussyhat they can't. It needs to be passed by a majority of MSPs. That's representative democracy.

How can they remove the very meaning of the word woman, sex based protections and freedom of speech without a vote and asking the 51% of the population directly effected by it (and not the 'women's' groups who supposedly represent us but prioritise penis havers)

From my understanding of system in Scotland, this is going through Parliament NOW. NOW is the time to lobby your MSPs about it. DON'T wait until election!

The Bill has to go through this Committee stage where amendmemts are discussed, then all the amendments are voted on by all MSPs. These are all public proceedings. They can do discussions of contents of amendments behind closed doors if they are looking to agree a compromise (some of the wording of the amendmemts looked a bit unworkable so improvements could be made). But they can't discuss and vite on them in private.

Lobby your MSPs NOW and ask for their view on women's rights. That will also help to guage how likely parties are to repeal anything that gets through too

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/reaction-scottish-hate-crime-bill-amendments-left-msp-alarmed-and-afraid-3121261

Adam Tomkins, convenor of the Justice Committee speaking an enormous amount of sense, here.

I'd agree with that Arabella.

Plus that females failing to keep their mouths shut and be obedient at all times to the needs of the superior humans, or daring to mention their own concerns and needs, will be punished.

So. If I have understood this right, Humza Yousaf is at great pains to consider the feelings and possible risks of a man who is cross dressing (but not trans) and transwomen.

He does not wish to protect the rights of women. He has stated that?

What about the addition of 'sex' and misogyny in the HCB that Johann Lamont proposed, was that discussed today, or is it to be discussed later?

It seems to me that this is more of seeing man as the default, and women as some nebulous formless miasma that just shapes to fit the needs, wants, fears, anxieties and desires of males, the superior humans.

To be fair, 52, I hear racism/xenophobia in both directions. Anti-English (which I would say I hear far less now than I did as a child) and anti-Scots, which really baffles me. Why move to a country if you are going to spend all your time bitching about the natives and trying to avoid them?

The 'English' thing is sad. When I first moved to Scotland from Kent as a mature student of 23 I ended up at Edinburgh Uni Mylnes Court Hall of residence up by the Castle with a lot of English home counties public school med student kids. I remember one of them dismissively referring to the lady who cleaned her room once a week as her 'maid' - the woman looked rightly pissed off. I loudly reminded LIttle Miss Tippytoes that she was in someone else's country and a bit of respect would be appropriate - the woman was not 'her maid' but domestic staff for the Uni, twice her age and probably far smarter (I was so angry I had a wee rant)
20 years later I'd moved as far as the Borders (but back in time about 20 years due to location as the Borders is quite old fashioned compared to Edinburgh) and I heard quite a lot of anti English sentiment (my kids got it too). Scotland is less racist than England (I am embarrassed to go back to parts of Kent), unless you are English it sometimes seems? Certainly the SNP didn't seem to publicly disown much of that during the last IndyRef which I hoped they might.
There is some weird cognitive dissonance about being anti-racism unless it involves the English, or anti x-'persons-rights' unless they are womens rights, or to promote the wellbeing of children but to actively cut out parents (whose decent functioning is so important to children).
I was surprised at the 'homophobic' comment though (I think they meant transphobe? who knows? we were all on fairly strong pain meds I suspect!) Maybe my experience is purely anecdata not typical.

Scotland is still a great place to live, but less if you are a woman now?

You know that vote you only got the right to as a woman just over 100 years ago.

So male cross-dressers need "transphobia" protection because they could be mistaken for being transwomen.

But females don't need protection, because no-one could possibly confuse a woman and a transwoman?

Okay, that's normally our line, but I guess they'll use it when convenient.