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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Eddie Izzard defends JKR

88 replies

TundraDweller · 02/01/2021 10:26

I was surprised to see this -
www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/eddie-izzard-jk-rowling-trans-gender-b632044.html

OP posts:
ClaireP20 · 02/01/2021 13:05

@JellySlice

The first sentence, most important thing in this article about the controversy surrounding a woman's statement, is to make sure that the readers understand that it's ok to use sex-accurate pronouns in reference to this man. It's ok because he permits it.

Pander to the penis

Exactly ..
MondayYogurt · 02/01/2021 12:59

I don't want to hear what Eddie thinks anymore.

OldCrone · 02/01/2021 12:58

I'm sure in the past he's been quite clear that he's just a straight, cisgender guy who happens to like wearing dresses. No problem with that. I don't know why the change now though or why the attempt to rewrite the past.

It wouldn't surprise me if TRAs told him he was undermining trans people by saying that men in dresses and make up were just men in dresses and make up.

JellySlice · 02/01/2021 12:55

@JellySlice

The first sentence, most important thing in this article about the controversy surrounding a woman's statement, is to make sure that the readers understand that it's ok to use sex-accurate pronouns in reference to this man. It's ok because he permits it.

Pander to the penis

It's rare I wish for an edit button on MN, but in this case I wish I could redact 'pander to the penis'.

It probably wasn't about allowing a male to dictate how we refer to him, but more about pacifying the TRA Wolf pack who might be expected to come batting after the writers who had the temerity to use sex-accurate pronouns in reference to a man. Tho as the most aggressive TRAs tends to be penis-havers...

OldCrone · 02/01/2021 12:54

We/people absolutely do need to prove that gender IS socially constructed by actively demonstrating that it's both okay and healthy to dress and consuct yourself in a traditionally feminine or masculine manner... regardless of your biological sex.

But once you start using wrong-sex pronouns for someone who doesn't conform to the stereotypes for their sex, you're reinforcing the stereotypes by saying that a masculine woman is somehow 'male'.

FifteenToes · 02/01/2021 12:51

I must admit, while Eddie has always come across as a decent and likeable person, he/she's never struck me as a great critical thinker (on political issues for example). I'm thus not hugely surprised that various statements about gender, pronouns etc. seem to contradict each other and don't add up to any coherent position. I'm sure in the past he's been quite clear that he's just a straight, cisgender guy who happens to like wearing dresses. No problem with that. I don't know why the change now though or why the attempt to rewrite the past.

The defence of JKR probably just comes from the fact that he's a basically nice guy who doesn't want to see people fighting. And as he doesn't have a set or coherent position on gender for her to offend, he's not offended by her.

SecretsofMine · 02/01/2021 12:50

*conduct

SecretsofMine · 02/01/2021 12:49

I have come across other gender fluid people on Twitter who think the same as Eddie.

Males who admit they are male and who are not ashamed of their gender fluidity ARE brave. I don't care what anyone says to the contrary.

Also women. I wouldn't say I'm a masculine female, though neither am I typically feminine. I'm single and I think many men are/would be turned off by my brand of gender fluidity. Their loss because I'm AMAZING!!

I think we also need to accept that women like this/me are also shunned by unrealistic societal expectations of feminity! The common perception is that it's easier for women to embrace their masculinity. Nothing could be further from the truth - the influences of mass media prove that.

We/people absolutely do need to prove that gender IS socially constructed by actively demonstrating that it's both okay and healthy to dress and consuct yourself in a traditionally feminine or masculine manner... regardless of your biological sex.

JellySlice · 02/01/2021 12:46

The first sentence, most important thing in this article about the controversy surrounding a woman's statement, is to make sure that the readers understand that it's ok to use sex-accurate pronouns in reference to this man. It's ok because he permits it.

Pander to the penis

OldCrone · 02/01/2021 12:46

From the 'he or she' article:

Has he contemplated transitioning? “I don’t have an answer to that. I do feel female, but if I was only expressing the female side of me, the boy side wouldn’t be represented. Whichever way, I’m slightly under-represented.”

How does a man 'feel female'? Does he mean 'feminine'?

From a man in a dress in the 90s to a man who thinks he's a woman when he puts on a dress. So progressive.

ThatIsNotMyUsername · 02/01/2021 12:43

What more was Eddie in when Eddie wrote this? What has JKR replied (‘awa an boil yer heid ’ - I know she isn’t Scottish but is an honorary one)?

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 12:41

Thanks for linking, OldCrone

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 12:40

Izzard talks about switching between boy-mode and girl-mode: “I’m gender fluid. Your brain gets coded male or female when you’re young. Mine got coded both ways. I have the gift of both, although it doesn’t feel like a gift at first.” He’s proactively in “girl-mode” at the moment, and hopes the running “makes people look at trans in a different way”.

Why won't he tell us what this male and female coding is? How do we know which we are? What does 'girl-mode' mean? What is it that makes him put himself in a box with my daughter than with ...other men? Why won't he spell it out for us?

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 12:30
Grin
Notts2021 · 02/01/2021 12:28

When I hear the words 'gender-fluid' I always think 'spunk'.
I'm surely not alone in this, am I?

Not now! Grin

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 12:24

I don't think he's backtracking.

I think he's fully immersed in tra ideology now, he thinks he's got a lady-brain and because he's got a pwetty lady-brain (sic) he just wants everyone to play nicely.

I really have no respect for anyone pedalling this regressive shite.

HecatesCats · 02/01/2021 12:07

"If they call me 'she' and 'her,' that's great - or 'he' and 'him,' I don't mind. I prefer to be called Eddie, that covers everything. I'm gender fluid."

The problem is that she/her mode involves regressive ideas about what a woman (or indeed girl as Eddie likes to refer to Eddieself) involves. Eddie used to be much more rational and consistent on this. Eddie's current views seem to be somewhat erratic and that does suggest Eddie courting popular support - Eddie was doing just fine on this before, but maybe his career needed the boost? No idea.

Nighthawker · 02/01/2021 12:06

I do wonder if Eddie is also backtracking a wee bit because there was considerable backlash to the she/her coverage

That was my first thought too. All very well for Eddie to say we need to look at what JK Rowling has actually written, but if he had done that and understood women and girls' need to protect single sex spaces then maybe he wouldn't be writing about squaring up to teenage girls who challenged him for being in the women's toilets.

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 12:01

When I hear the words 'gender-fluid' I always think 'spunk'.
I'm surely not alone in this, am I?

Anyway, this is a guy who inserts himself in women's spaces and then accuses the children who didn't want him there of bullying him.
This is a guy who thinks he sometimes has a 'man mode' and sometimes 'girl mode' - his way of thinking hurts women. I hope people don't listen to his errant, self-obsessed unscientific crap.

Dontbeme · 02/01/2021 11:58

I hate the idea we are fighting between ourselves, but it's not going to be sorted with the wave of a wand

This raises my hackles, EI is positioning this as a wee bit of petty bickering and shouldn't we all just get along, when the reality is that women's sex based rights are being eroded and women that speak out on that are shouted down as bigots and risk their livlihoods as well as face threats of rape and murder. He also claims he didn't push being referred to as she on the program but didn't he ask to be referred to as she\her? It was hardly spontaneous on the part of others on the show. I think he is disingenuous and will follow the path that gets him press and attention.

Vimtoinmilk · 02/01/2021 11:57

Watching with interest. Glad he's spoken up but still concerned about his apparrent disregard for the way women feel having men in their spaces.

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 11:56

Has anyone got a telegraph share token?

Unless you are believers in "pink lady-brain" theory, I can't see anything impressive about Eddie's latest pronouncements at all.

ClaireP20 · 02/01/2021 11:53

"I don't think JK Rowling is transphobic".

It isn't quite the same as saying 'JK Rowling isn't transphobic' is it???

He has hardly said anything supportive at all - anyone with half a brain knows she isn't transphobic. He is clearly playing the gallery - whilst trying not to offend the trans lobby either.

He's a self obsessed idiot.

Helmetbymidnight · 02/01/2021 11:53

Yeah, they've definitely taken the bit out where Eddie talks about the way his brain is "coded".