Attacking the next first lady of the USA - Dr Jill Biden

Ah Epstein has no PhD himself, despite having been an academic. That would have rankled. Sour grapes? Well at least the world now knows that Epstein somehow failed to achieve a PhD. He has an honorary doctorate, but that is not the same (and I wonder if he engineered even that).

I’m now catapulted back to an ongoing debate between two ex boyfriends of mine, who had followed similar career trajectories and had a bitter professional rivalry. Both had PhDs, one would use the title and one wouldn’t. The one who wouldn’t would always refer, sneeringly, to the one who did as “Doctor” Kenny; “so what’s Doctor Kenny up to these days, still trying to impress girls with his qualifications is he?”, “wonder what Doctor Kenny would make of that, eh?”

The whole thing was magnificently petty Joe Epstein would have enjoyed it.

.. Don’t forget we have plenty of PhDs from Christian colleges that will assert that the world is merely 6000 years old (or whatever)..

Flipping heck is that true?

(Not the 6000 years thing, the people getting PhDs in nonsense thing.)

I tend to agree with this POV in all honesty. Should I call someone with a doctorate in queer studies Dr so-and-so? Lots of worthless PhDs out there...

Define 'worthless PhD'
All PhD research contributes to knowledge in a particular field, just because it's not a field you are interested in or one that you feel is worthwhile doesn't make the qualification worthless.

The "style guidelines" in my house are that you use the titles that people have worked hard to earn, and respect their effort. When people refuse to respect that, they are refusing to respect the people, and that is very evident in the piece under discussion here. It is not a matter of whether you agree with some random "house style" - that very house style is wrong and disrespectful, and I am surprised that any writer / journalist can't see that. But then, there's a lot of writers with little or no education or intelligence as well. I'm sure you'd agree.

A genuine piece on the times and places that it might or might not be appropriate to use your title could easily have been achieved without being so mean spirited and patronising to Dr Biden.

Yes. The WSJ opted for clickbait, when they could have commissioned a perfectly reasonable article by a writer who doesn't ooze misogyny.

Perhaps you would be less "weary" if you stopped explaining to people why they aren't entitled to use the honorifics that they have earned and grew up a bit. Jealous or what?

Touched a nerve there. I never said that people can’t use honorifics, just that I agree with the style guidelines set out in a lot of publications. And there’s a good reason for it, as there are a lot of quack PhDs out there. Don’t forget we have plenty of PhDs from Christian colleges that will assert that the world is merely 6000 years old (or whatever). Should we respect that? I think not.

I've been reading Victorian novels where families oppose marriage to a mere GP. I think there have been a few digs about 'so-called doctors' which I'd been puzzled by.

Thanks to posters for explaining the Oxbridge higher-degree system.

However as noted below, the WJS is the other alongside NYT which uses Dr for doctorates

AFAIK the NYT doesn’t automatically grant the ‘Dr’ for PhDs. Here’s an excerpt from the NYT style guide:

Dr. should be used in all references for physicians and dentists whose practice is their primary current occupation, or who work in a closely related field, like medical writing, research or pharmaceutical manufacturing: Dr. Alex E. Baranek; Dr. Baranek; the doctor. (Those who practice only incidentally, or not at all, should be called Mr., Ms., Miss or Mrs.)

Anyone else with an earned doctorate, like a Ph.D. degree, may request the title, but only if it is germane to the holder’s primary current occupation (academic, for example, or laboratory research). For a Ph.D., the title should appear only in second and later references. The holder of a Ph.D. or equivalent degree may also choose not to use the title.

So a bit more complicated than the AP.

Also, as an example, Ben Carson typically is just Mr Carson at NYT, but it’s because he’s retired and is written about in his capacity as a politician, not medical doctor as per the guidelines.

I bet he is doubling down, digging his heels in, or whatever people say now..

Perhaps you would be less "weary" if you stopped explaining to people why they aren't entitled to use the honorifics that they have earned and grew up a bit. Jealous or what?

The man's an idiot. Fwiw, I don't think the title of Dr Biden's thesis (not "dissertation"), Student Retention at the Community College Level: Meeting Students' Needs, is "unpromising". But apart from that, she has a PhD and she is entitled to use it regardless of whether other people think she is showing off.

As a general point, I think that when an individual makes a personal attack on another individual, 90% of the time it's out of envy.

Most US-based publications I’ve worked for follow the AP guidelines on this, which would just use Jill Biden without the honorific.

Titles are less used in the US in general. However as noted below, the WJS is the other alongside NYT which uses Dr for doctorates.

My favourite response to this outrageous man was this -

Bernice King, the youngest daughter of civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr, offered her support to the future first lady in a tweet: "My father was a non-medical doctor. And his work benefited humanity greatly. Yours does, too."

If people are confused by the fact that people other than M.D.s might be Drs, well I don’t know what to say

It’s a quite common misperception though, no less than Whoopi Goldberg said that she’d make a great surgeon general because she’s an amazing doctor ....

Most US-based publications I’ve worked for follow the AP guidelines on this, which would just use Jill Biden without the honorific.

Unless you are the NYT which still insists on using Mr./Mrs. which is pretty old-fashioned 😓

Also...

I just don’t understand why people think me using Mrs would be more appropriate. Marrying my husband was easy, getting the PhD was hard work.

If our other ‘titles’ weren’t largely dependent upon our marital status (where a man’s is not) it might not irk me so much, but it is. I use Dr for work purposes, it’s on my driving license (not my bank account because France doesn’t permit it - it’s Mr and Mrs [husband’s name] surname, on our joint account 🤬). It’s not on my passport, I don’t want to cause confusion in the case of a medical emergency on a plane.

If people are confused by the fact that people other than M.D.s might be Drs, well I don’t know what to say. That’s no my problem. I don’t insist on people calling me doctor in my everyday life (unless they’re being a condescending prick 🤷🏻‍♀️).

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A couple of people have mentioned Oxbridge, but I think there is some confusion. As far as I'm aware, Oxbridge graduates have never been able to claim a doctorate without doing anything - you would have to do a PhD (or a DPhil, which is the same thing) just as you would anywhere else.

People are probably thinking of the Oxbridge MAs which you could claim several years after graduation - I never bothered with mine and did a real master's instead, but even if I had, it wouldn't have entitled me to call myself a doctor!

Oh yes, it’s MAs. What was I thinking.
Of course the Europeans got there first. My brain has been addled by Brexit.

Are Oxford graduates still able to claim a doctorate without actually completing one?

Afaik it's MAs they can claim, not doctorates.

It that the origin of medical Drs being Drs generally - were medical degrees originally only Oxbridge qualifications (I expect someone will tell me Edinburgh was awarding them centuries earlier)?

Bologna and Paris, actually. they were originally licenses to teach theology, law and medicine.

I think that if Jill Biden wishes to use the title 'Dr' that is her choice.

@Sittinbythesea like you I dislike the idea of First Lady (or even First Gentleman). Judge a person by who they are, not who they are married to.

House style of publications doesn't dictate use elsewhere, but apparently the style of the WSJ is to use Dr for PhDs and physicians. Whether there is any distinction made between EdD and PhDs in the US I don't know - some of the 'xD' degrees such as JD are classified as masters (7)rather than doctoral level, but as far as I can see EdD is doctoral level (8)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor(title)#Unitedd_States

First Lady is the silliest title of all though!

How horribly misogynistic. He could have just expressed ideas about when dr should / shouldn’t be used in an entirely non offensive way. I do feel that using Dr for a phd should be restricted to areas where it’s relevant, eg at an academic conference. that’s what I’d do anyway (if I had had the brains, determination etc to do a phd). Lots of titles seem very outdated - miss? Sir? ... all silly.