Page 12 | Would you ok your son wearing a dress?

KristinaJup · 2020-12-12T18:46:53+00:00

Candace Owens recently tweeted (in response to Harry Styles wearing a dress on a magazine cover) "Bring Back Manly Men".. amongst other things. Who really cares if a guy wears tutus and glittery dresses? Prince was hot af in his heels and Makeup. Imo I would have no problem with it at all if my son wanted to put on a skirt but the tweet gained a lot of traction and I saw quite a few memes and lots of fingers pointed at feminism for "ruining men" If we carry on this way the next thing will be....women should not be wearing trousers! What do you think?

RufustheSniggeringReindeer · 13/12/2020 12:11

which according to some FWR regulars are the only way girls will take up sciences

I don’t think there are any FWR regulars who say that no girl in a mixed sex school takes up science

RufustheSniggeringReindeer · 13/12/2020 12:08

Dh had one of my maxi dresses on a year ago, he looked really good in it

Cept he had it on backwards

Biscuitsanddoombar · 13/12/2020 12:06

@Viviennemary

The trouble is when you start saying fine to your D'S about wearing dresses as every day wear when do you start saying no. All these people saying it's ok. Would they be fine with their male partners wearing dresses as every day wear. No. And that's the crunch. You are storing up trouble for the future.

I dont find men in dresses attractive the same as I don’t find men with blond hair/long hair/beards attractive. I wouldn’t date a man who wore dresses but then I wouldn’t date a man with a beard either!

Bewarethesealions · 13/12/2020 11:58

...and not all women wear dresses; I know a few women (of different shapes and sizes) who really don't like them and never wear them. Which is fine, I hope!

Absolutely. I can remember getting into a similar argument in the workplace many years ago (back in the mid-90s), when management tried to force me to wear a skirt.

My reply was "when you make the men wear them, then yes, I'll consider wearing one, until then I'll be wearing trousers", at which point the conversation was terminated rather abruptly.

Rainedere · 13/12/2020 11:55

I suggest you read Inferior by Angela Saini

Is that to me or the poster who quoted me?

Viviennemary · 13/12/2020 11:46

The trouble is when you start saying fine to your D'S about wearing dresses as every day wear when do you start saying no. All these people saying it's ok. Would they be fine with their male partners wearing dresses as every day wear. No. And that's the crunch. You are storing up trouble for the future.

FunkBus · 13/12/2020 11:42

"And it might be controversial but l like my man to be manly - seeing him in a dress would be an absolute turn off."

But we're talking about children. I don't care if my son is manly or not.

Some boyfriends I'd have been ok with wearing a dress. My husband though...nah. I mean, if he wanted to (and it wasn't for weird fetish reasons), fine, but it would look very odd and out of place.

But in his culture, men wear long flowy things that are quite dresslike and that looks fine. Part of the problem with Harry Styles is that the dresses he wore are designed for having boobs and hips in them and they just look rubbish on his body.

He just looks so awkward. It's too self conscious and knowing.

SimonJT · 13/12/2020 11:35

@Fishfingersandwichplease

I want to say l would be ok with it but something inside me makes me feel really uncomfortable when my daughter's male friend comes round and puts her dresses on. They are 9. And it might be controversial but l like my man to be manly - seeing him in a dress would be an absolute turn off.

Whats manly?

People should wear things because they like them, not to turn someone else on.

DidoLamenting · 13/12/2020 11:25

@CatsCantCatchCriminals2

Certainly neither me or any of the girls in the top set were discouraged or bullied for doing Maths.

That's good to hear, Dido. I am very pleased of course that you were not bullied at school (for that).

Just out of curiosity tho' - was there any bullying at your school and if there was, what sort of things attracted the attention of the bullies?

I was bullied in my 4th year (15/16) by a small group of girls. It wasn't connected to being good at maths particularly or even being clever, but I think the combination of being pretty and clever upset them. That doesn't alter the fact the school encouraged everyone who had the potential to do Maths, to do it.

Bit of an aside but if girls are supposedly discouraged from doing sciences how come the intake to medicine is now more than 50% female and veterinary school even more so? It's been so for a while now. All these science undergraduates can't all have gone to the relatively few single sex schools, which according to some FWR regulars are the only way girls will take up sciences.

Pinkclarko · 13/12/2020 11:21

In principle I’m all for it, but then again we do care what others think of us, and there will always be those who push against a move away from the norm. I’d like to teach my son not to care about such opinions but equally would be upset about him being targeted so it’s not as straightforward as it should be. Agree that Harry is probably is just maybe doing it to stay provocative and relevant but that’s ok isn’t it? It’s just showbiz.

likeamillpond · 13/12/2020 11:21

@CatsCantCatchCriminals2

likeamillpond you didn't say, but were you able to dress like him without looking ridiculous?

(I'm guessing you looked great and are too modest to say..)

I did actually. Look great

Sorry

jellyfrizz · 13/12/2020 11:18

@Rainedere

*Absolute load of bollox. Gender is a social construct, and all things aimed at a particular gender are made by man, not nature. Biology has fuck all to do with a boy playing with a truck or a girl a doll. Did you know that until fairly recently it was normal to have male toddlers in dresses with longer hair?en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breeching_(boys)considered completely normal and yet would be odd if it happened today. Did you also know that it's also a fairly modern concept to have girls = pink and boys = blue, and that it used to be the other way around?*

I used to agree with social constructionism up until I actually looked at studies where macaque monkeys had gendered toy preference and that even in hunter-gatherer societies these gender behaviours kind of prove that some behaviours are innate to someone's sex such as aggression, interests and sexual behaviour. Its universal in most societies including those who have had no influence from other more egalitarian societies.

I suggest you read Inferior by Angela Saini.

CatsCantCatchCriminals2 · 13/12/2020 11:18

likeamillpond you didn't say, but were you able to dress like him without looking ridiculous?

(I'm guessing you looked great and are too modest to say..)

likeamillpond · 13/12/2020 11:16

@ncbby

Dresses and skirts need a female bum. It doesn't hang right at the back otherwise

What about women who have small bums? I think you're trying to insult men who wear dresses but a lot of the impact of that is actually hitting women who don't have physical bodies that they "should have" due to their biological femaleness according to you.

I'm not trying to insult men who wear dresses. My automatic reaction on seeing a man wearing a dress is You look ridiculous.

It's an automatic thought process.

CatsCantCatchCriminals2 · 13/12/2020 11:15

Not all women have big hips, not all women have narrow shoulders, not all women have big breasts, not all women have shapely thighs.

...and not all women wear dresses; I know a few women (of different shapes and sizes) who really don't like them and never wear them. Which is fine, I hope!

we really couldn't have a conversation like this about an item of "male" clothing. Could we?

KarenMarlow3 · 13/12/2020 11:15

Biology has fuck all to do with a boy playing with a truck or a girl a doll
Actually it does. There was an experiment where young chimps were given a choice of toys. The male chimps went for the trucks and the females went for the dolls.
All this 'boys wearing dresses is fine' is only a reflection on today's political agendas, with people jumping on the latest bandwagon of nonsense.
Twenty years ago, no reasonable parent would have been ok with their son dressing as a girl.
Society's values shift over time, and I am expecting this particular shift to die out in a few years.

DidoLamenting · 13/12/2020 11:14

@berrygirlie

That's potentially true, Dido. I suppose there is always a bit of a competition as to who can be the next legend amongst celebrities, and maybe wearing dresses is a part of that to a certain extent.

I think the grey dress in Vogue was very unattractive (but I don't like the square neckline ruched thing as it reminds me of the dresses I wore when I was a little girl). I don't dislike the one I've attached though - it looks a little matronly but it's my favourite out of the ones he's worn.

That is his best one.

likeamillpond · 13/12/2020 11:13

I went to a party with my other half a few years ago and we had to dress up aseachother.
He s an average looking male who usually looks nice.
He wore one of my dresses and quite frankly he looked ridiculous.
I think it was his knobbly knees, muscle ycalves and big hairy feet.
His male straight up and down shape didn't help either.
He looked ridiculous.
Men's shapes dont lend themselves to looking good in dresses.
Encouraging them to think they do so is setting them up for ridicule.
I'm entitled to an opinion.

CatsCantCatchCriminals2 · 13/12/2020 11:11

"... And it might be controversial but l like my man to be manly..."

Ooh! There's a thread on that word today.

Buttybach · 13/12/2020 11:10

I think also by putting a man in a women's magazine the stylist had to make a statement about gender. It's got everybody talking and that's what magazines thrive on in the digital age.

CatsCantCatchCriminals2 · 13/12/2020 11:09

@FourPlatinumRings

We have have waists and hips and narrow shoulders, breasts and shapely thighs.

Woah. Generalise, much? So those with a lollipop body shape look ridiculous in dresses? Cheers.

I'm now thinking of Olive Oyl!

ncbby · 13/12/2020 11:08

Dresses and skirts need a female bum. It doesn't hang right at the back otherwise

What about women who have small bums? I think you're trying to insult men who wear dresses but a lot of the impact of that is actually hitting women who don't have physical bodies that they "should have" due to their biological femaleness according to you.

likeamillpond · 13/12/2020 11:06

Even a woman with a lollupop shape will srill look better than most men who try to wear dresses.0

earthyfire · 13/12/2020 11:06

I'd be worried about him being bullied. Children pick on anything to bully and tease about. My son went to school in a Grinch Christmas jumper and got stick because apprently the Grinch is now all over Kylie Jenner's merchandise! So, can you imagine if he wore a dress? Annoys me but no I wouldn't encourage him to wear a dress outside of the house. However, we have loads of home video footage of him dressing up in his sister's play dresses when he was younger.

ncbby · 13/12/2020 11:06

The reason women suit dresses is because we have female shape and form which lends itself to suiting a dress.
We have have waists and hips and narrow shoulders, breasts and shapely thighs

Not all women have big hips, not all women have narrow shoulders, not all women have big breasts, not all women have shapely thighs. Some men have some of these things. There are dresses to accommodate for women who don't have the "standard" feminine form, or women who have more masculine body types, and so there could easily be dress styles that flattered male physiques also.

However, if you think dresses on men look bad then that's fine, it's a personal preference, but to suggest that it's a valid reason to stop someone from wearing the clothes they want to wear is incomprehensible.