Page 6 | The Baroness takes on La Leche League

CaveMum · 2020-12-02T19:54:00+00:00

Yet another fantastic letter from Baroness Nicholson to La Leche League re their stance on “chest feeding”. [[https://twitter.com/baroness_nichol/status/1334210792468717573?s=21]]

happydappy2 · 02/12/2020 21:18

Does male chest liquid have any nutritional benefits for a baby? I doubt it, surely formula is more nutritious.

HecatesCats · 02/12/2020 21:11

I personally think safeguarding is just as important, if not more. Who benefits from LLL allowing transwomen who want to breastfeed to attend breastfeeding groups, as per their policy? Who benefits from transwomen receiving support to attempt this from an organisation set up to support mothers, as per their mission statement. The Baroness is quite right to draw attention to the charity's mission statement and its meaning.

FlibbertyGiblets · 02/12/2020 21:11

Brava, Baroness.

Original poster

CaveMum · 02/12/2020 21:08

The key difference between restarting lactation or stimulating it in an adoptive mother or same sex partner is that the drugs are taken for a short time to get the milk supply established. Once established the woman’s body secretes the natural hormones to maintain supply. A man cannot naturally lactate in sufficient quantities to nourish an infant and therefore they must continue to take the drugs throughout the process, thus exposing the child to far higher quantities of the drugs than they were originally intended for. If you can’t see a problem with that then I wash my hands.

OP posts:

Quillink · 02/12/2020 21:08

Male chest liquids. Queasily spot on.

AnotherEmma · 02/12/2020 21:07

This "infographic" did the rounds in August (breastfeeding awareness month), lunacy.
It's a huge issue and it's not just La Leche League who have bought into this hook, line and sinker.

LouHotel · 02/12/2020 21:07

Yes yes yes yes.

I'm posting it I to my local breastfeeding support Facebook group.

LaValliere · 02/12/2020 21:06

Hum ho, I don’t actually like her letter. it uses some emotive terms and that will make it easier to dismiss. I also don’t think that the recent case on the meaning of ‘mother’ is a substantive or useful point.

If I were her I would have focused solely on the medical aspect - I would have asked what research LL had done on the drugs involved, & on their potential consequences for the baby; whether LL is confident the drugs concerned will have no adverse consequences for the baby; if so what medical & pharmacological research grounds this confidence; if not, what the ethical implications of this are; what the likely concentration of the drugs in the milk is; whether LL have taken legal advice about their potential liability for damages if they encourage this & a baby is damaged, etc.

But then she bothered to write & I didn’t - so good for her.

I suspect LL has not looked into these issues at all & is just spouting woke gibberish - they need to be reminded of the important person here who is the baby. Not an adult male. The baby, who is definitely not Gillick competent & cannot consent to ingesting drugs that are of no medical benefit to it whatsoever.

Pahrump · 02/12/2020 21:06

A friendly reminder that some people like to cause consternation and goad posters into a deletion or ban 🙂

HecatesCats · 02/12/2020 21:02

Because they're predominantly women who have given birth to their child and they are lactating as a result of that process. Why would a transwoman want to breastfeed a baby a woman has given birth to?

Pahrump · 02/12/2020 21:02

@PinkyU

I’ve seen this reference before and looked into it as I’d no idea that LLLGB had stopped using “breastfeeding” and started using “chestfeeding”, but that’s not actually what’s happened.

In all, bar none, of their literature they use “breastfeeding”, they have included (not substituted for) “chestfeeding” in their transgender and non binary information. For those who appreciate the inclusion of an alternative name.

I could see the issue if LLLGB had completely annihilated the term breastfeeding but they’ve not, they don’t even include “chestfeeding” in the vast, vast majority of their text, it’s only there if you’ve specifically sought that advice, information or support.

How does this negatively impact you?

Umm... did you completely miss the part about males wanting to breastfeed babies?

PinkyU · 02/12/2020 21:01

yourhair And just because an act is not prevalent in your circle or society it’s doesn’t make it repugnant.

PinkyU · 02/12/2020 21:00

Why does anyone want to breastfeed their child?

yourhairiswinterfire · 02/12/2020 20:54

@PinkyU

There are a number of cultures which have historically (some which still do) normalised Male lactation. It’s not a new concept.

And?

yourhairiswinterfire · 02/12/2020 20:54

*not males taking, liquid being made for males.

Redshoeblueshoe · 02/12/2020 20:53

Excellent letter.

HecatesCats · 02/12/2020 20:53

@PinkyU

The protocol used to induce lactation is the same that’s used for adoptive parents, same sex couples, parents seeking to relactate, those who have IGT or have undergone mastectomy’s.

Whilst not ideal (as in anything that requires outside influence in a natural event), it’s not unsafe provided any medications are monitored.

Do you have an issue with all of the above also?

Here we go again. Why would a transwoman want to breastfeed a baby?

PinkyU · 02/12/2020 20:52

There are a number of cultures which have historically (some which still do) normalised Male lactation. It’s not a new concept.

yourhairiswinterfire · 02/12/2020 20:51

@PinkyU

I’ve seen this reference before and looked into it as I’d no idea that LLLGB had stopped using “breastfeeding” and started using “chestfeeding”, but that’s not actually what’s happened.

In all, bar none, of their literature they use “breastfeeding”, they have included (not substituted for) “chestfeeding” in their transgender and non binary information. For those who appreciate the inclusion of an alternative name.

I could see the issue if LLLGB had completely annihilated the term breastfeeding but they’ve not, they don’t even include “chestfeeding” in the vast, vast majority of their text, it’s only there if you’ve specifically sought that advice, information or support.

How does this negatively impact you?

It's all explained in Baroness Nicholson's letter, did you read it?

It's about males taking a drug that is forbidden for children, to create liquid to feed a baby. A drug that causes heart failure in men. How is that in the best interests of any baby?

PinkyU · 02/12/2020 20:51

The protocol used to induce lactation is the same that’s used for adoptive parents, same sex couples, parents seeking to relactate, those who have IGT or have undergone mastectomy’s.

Whilst not ideal (as in anything that requires outside influence in a natural event), it’s not unsafe provided any medications are monitored.

Do you have an issue with all of the above also?

FamilyOfAliens · 02/12/2020 20:47

@PinkyU

I’ve seen this reference before and looked into it as I’d no idea that LLLGB had stopped using “breastfeeding” and started using “chestfeeding”, but that’s not actually what’s happened.

In all, bar none, of their literature they use “breastfeeding”, they have included (not substituted for) “chestfeeding” in their transgender and non binary information. For those who appreciate the inclusion of an alternative name.

I could see the issue if LLLGB had completely annihilated the term breastfeeding but they’ve not, they don’t even include “chestfeeding” in the vast, vast majority of their text, it’s only there if you’ve specifically sought that advice, information or support.

How does this negatively impact you?

So you’re saying that it’s ok to talk about natal males “chest feeding” a baby if you only mention it a few times?

Original poster

CaveMum · 02/12/2020 20:45

@PinkyU

I’ve seen this reference before and looked into it as I’d no idea that LLLGB had stopped using “breastfeeding” and started using “chestfeeding”, but that’s not actually what’s happened.

In all, bar none, of their literature they use “breastfeeding”, they have included (not substituted for) “chestfeeding” in their transgender and non binary information. For those who appreciate the inclusion of an alternative name.

I could see the issue if LLLGB had completely annihilated the term breastfeeding but they’ve not, they don’t even include “chestfeeding” in the vast, vast majority of their text, it’s only there if you’ve specifically sought that advice, information or support.

How does this negatively impact you?

It’s not just about the awful term “chest feeding” it’s about the fact that LLL are saying it’s perfectly fine for a male to pump himself full of artificial hormones in order to produce a synthetic “milk” and to feed that to an infant. No consideration for the infant and what effect said drugs might have on them, it’s all about the validation of the male ego.

And then of course there’s the issue of permitting Transwomen to attend breastfeeding support groups for women only.

OP posts:

PerditaNitt · 02/12/2020 20:42

Wonderful letter. Impossible for anyone with an ounce of sanity to disagree with her.

Male chest liquid is really giving me the ick. The thought of feeding it to a baby is horrendous.

SirSamuelVimes · 02/12/2020 20:42

I absolutely LOVE her.

PinkyU · 02/12/2020 20:41

I’ve seen this reference before and looked into it as I’d no idea that LLLGB had stopped using “breastfeeding” and started using “chestfeeding”, but that’s not actually what’s happened.

In all, bar none, of their literature they use “breastfeeding”, they have included (not substituted for) “chestfeeding” in their transgender and non binary information. For those who appreciate the inclusion of an alternative name.

I could see the issue if LLLGB had completely annihilated the term breastfeeding but they’ve not, they don’t even include “chestfeeding” in the vast, vast majority of their text, it’s only there if you’ve specifically sought that advice, information or support.

How does this negatively impact you?