Transgender teen removed from parents in order to start hormone treatment in Australis

hoodathunkit same here. I had a diagnosis of PTSD and was in a pretty bad way. I could only see that my way was the right way. After considerable pressure to see a counselor (I didn't want to, but I did) I can honestly say it was the best thing I ever did. Things became so much clearer and I was able to face my difficulties in a far more level headed and less destructive (to myself) manner. Why on earth wouldn't we take this harmless route first rather than immediately opting for serious and harmful surgery.

Surely if a child is suicidal they need psychiatric support?

Excellent point

Even an adult who is suicidal should be discouraged from making major life changing decisions, such as divorce, moving house, changing job etc. while in the middle of a serious mental health crisis.

When I was (wrongly) diagnosed with delusional disorder (I do have PTSD) I attended various charities providing support for vulnerable people and met many people who were very mentally unwell and who were "transitioning".

It's a disgrace.

Also, people should be aware that the promoters of Qanon and various other conspiracy theories also promote the conspiracy that the state is stealing / kidnapping children from their loving parents via interventions from evil Social Services. The Save / the our Children recent protests are an example of this.

The scandalous events in the OP could arguably be used, and probably will be used, by conspiracy theorists to give credence to their claims

How is someone so depressed to the point they're suicidal in a fit state to make a decision that could impact the rest of their life?

They can't. Simple as that really. I don't know what the fuck is wrong with people to think transing depressed kids is ok. It's important to get to the root of the problem. It may be that after assessment and therapy the right decision is to tranistion. But it's more likely that it isn't the right decision. What kind of people think this heavy handed approach with a strong likelihood of a very poor outcome is acceptable? Surely the starting place is to do no harm. This is government sanctioned child abuse on a huge scale.

I wonder what type of home or facility this teen will be placed in? Will it be in a home with other teens and kids with serous issues, criminal records, violent, addicts... will it be with people who will only reinforce the pathway and not question it? Who is looking out for this teen - and I can tell you, it’s people who pack up and go home to their own families at the end of the day.

The child was s suicide risk. The parents wouldn't listen and continued to push their own agenda.

Depression will be causing the suicidal feelings. This is rarely just because of one single issue, and any decent medical professional should want to get to the bottom of it all.

How is someone so depressed to the point they're suicidal in a fit state to make a decision that could impact the rest of their life?

The parents just wanted a second opinion especially considering the side effects the thing is if she was just suicidal they would have done it ASAP but because the trans label has been dropped in they are over reacting

And it’s worth remembering that certain effects of testosterone - facial hair and voice changes for instance - are irreversible very quickly after commencement, within 6 months.

Being an immigrant doesn't mean they are an ethnic minority. They may have come from the UK. I agree that a suicidal child needs a psychiatric assessment not irreversible changes to their body and removed from their parents. If someone is depressed and suicidal they should not be making life changing possibly irreversible decisions. The child needs psychiatric input not chemicals and cosmetic surgery.

Surely if a child is suicidal they need psychiatric support?

How does transitioning reduce suicidal ideation anyway? My understanding is that it has good effect initially, and then as people realise they can't meet the image they have of themselves post transition, the mood disorders return.

It'd be handy if we had some decent long term data on the population who desist. Apparently, though, good science is hateful.

In a few years these children will be seeking compensation for these surgical procedures. IMHO.

This is a very bad call, given our history of child removals. No Australian with a smidgen of historical knowledge could think child removal by the state, absent some very compelling reasons, is in the child's best interests. Especially the child of minorities (the parents are immigrants).

The family ought to have been supported to organise psychological therapy for their child's suicidal ideation, and if necessary, to have had assistance parenting a mentally unwell child. That would take actual thought and effort.

I'm glad I was living in a more conservative state when my kid was in the depths of ROGD and co-morbid issues.

Re: Kelvin is specific to stage 2, that is, cross sex hormones so it’s directly related to this child’s testosterone and as a child in care, a court would likely be - should be- involved in making the decision to start it.

Any child can be subject to court intervention for medical treatment if it’s deemed necessary.

The Australian family court rulings for medical treatment for children are hugely flawed based on what we know now.

What about medical treatment not

Do they need to go to court for mon emergency treatment?

Is this kid potentially in the same situation in care?

Just checked and you do still need to go to court if a child is in care of the state, as ruled in Re: Kelvin.

Please note that you may still need Court authorisation in the following circumstances:

•There is a genuine dispute between parents, or people who have parental responsibility for a child, as to whether treatment should proceed

•There is a dispute between the child and / or their parents and medical staff as to whether treatment should proceed

•There is a genuine dispute between the child and their parents as to whether treatment should proceed (if the child is not competent)

•If a child is under the protection of a state welfare authority.

justiceconnect.org.au/re-kelvin-a-big-win-for-stage-2-access/

I remember hearing a recording of a doctor counselling parents and teens to say outright that they will commit suicide if they didn’t get the treatment they wanted (same as this teen).

The narrative is ‘better a live X than a dead Y’. Lots of teens are suicidal - when I was at school it was the goths and the lesbians (and some of the melodramatic girls).

So take all kids away from parents if they want something, won’t be handed it and they threaten to kill themselves?

And why do we have adults fighting for the ability to be able to self ID without having to change anything about themselves at all , simultaneously fighting for children to access medication etc

Sadly many people have been suicidal. It doesn’t mean someone is thinking clearly and rationally and coherently and long term.

If a teen is pregnant you would hope the parents give clear and honest information about the reality of raising a baby, adoption and termination and ask for outside help and counselling so the teen could make an informed choice about what’s affecting their body. Better to have all the information so you can make the best decision for you

Should the state intervene to prevent the parents getting the child some mental health support?

What is the problem with therapy. Whats to be afraid of.

Should the state intervene to prevent the parents getting the child some mental health support?

The child was s suicide risk. The parents wouldn't listen and continued to push their own agenda

In which case it is particularly important to explore the reasons behind the child's depression rather than pushing them down a non reversible transition pathway. Because if that turns out to be the wrong decision they certainly will have something to be depressed about. A second opinion on such an important decision is part of the safeguards. And anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool.

I would hope the judges involved in the Australian Family Court who were involved in previous rulings for stage one and stage two treatments (Re: Kelvin, Re: Jamie etc) are watching the Keira Bell case closely. They were told in those rulings puberty blockers were just a pause, reversible etc, and having read the various different rulings I don’t think the implications of long term testosterone was really tackled.

I am also fairly sure that once a child is in the care of the state the decision is supposed to go before a judge, but I’m not 100% sure.

But if the state then inject that child with testosterone....with all the life changing effects that will follow-that is just awful. Those poor parents & that poor child is now extremely vulnerable

Yes what are they planning on doing ? I mean in 2 years time tbe kid will be put onto adult services ? Can regular treatment even be done in the care system I mean won't there be multiple needs/demands to deal with in a group session , can it be relied on to provide this treatment at the regular intervals required? And what do they plan on doing when the kid is am adult ? Why are they starting something they can't finish. Where does that even leave the child?

The child was s suicide risk. The parents wouldn't listen and continued to push their own agenda.

Bodily autonomy.

There is no such court.