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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Ooo, Jo Maugham isn't happy...

313 replies

Xanthangum · 23/11/2020 08:23

Jo Maugham (@JolyonMaugham) Tweeted:
"We waited some weeks for the BBC to be ready to cover our legal action to protect the legal rights of trans children. And the piece is up and is quite extraordinary. I'm not going to link to it because it is inaccurate and gives space to a transphobic hate group." twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1330758709140729856?s=20

Which I assume refers to this piece:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55015959

And he says this about LGB Alliance, which feels stupidly for a lawyer libellous: The third point is they have quoted the so-called LGB Alliance - a dark money funded astro-turfed hate group - on the healthcare of trans teenagers. What next? Will the BBC be quoting white supremacists on whether sickle cell anaemia should be treated on the NHS?

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SophocIestheFox · 24/11/2020 06:36

That sounds tough, fraida Flowers

KiposWonderbeasts · 24/11/2020 06:18

@Fraida, it must be awful and you have my sympathy. My own teen with ASD and a MH crisis had us worried to death, and we weren’t fighting against a tide of Mermaids misinformation.

AvocadoBathroom · 24/11/2020 01:28

Skills? I meant skin!

AvocadoBathroom · 24/11/2020 01:21

I question what skills he has exactly in the game. Same with OJ. They ramp up the narrative with such aggressive enthusiasm.

DancelikeEmmaGoldman · 24/11/2020 01:20

Was there a newsletter distributed with appropriate talking points for allies? Because Naomi Wolf read it too. With Xmas coming up, I’d be happy for a large bundle of used twenties to be dropped over my garden gate

I’ve yet to see any financial return for having sold my soul to the dark side. There’s an annoying whiff of sulphur about in the mornings, but that could be the eggs for tea, I suppose.

Ooo, Jo Maugham isn't happy...
Fraida · 23/11/2020 23:54

@MillieEpple

I dont think thats fair. When your child is hugely struggling you end up desperate and if medical professionals are telling you this is the solution then you put your trust in them. It can take a long time to feel confident enough to stand up to the professionals. I have this with my sons SEN. At first we did everything we were told. Not all of us understand medical language even. I still get told things like 'child is maladaptive and needs excessive proprioceptive input' and have to head off and look up each word, then assess if their solution is in any way evidenced. I dont have a degree. I was under social services care and got a job at 17 as a secretary.

Its why its really important those with education and time fight as parents are too exhausted looking after their unhappy child.

Absolutely - dealing with both Autism and a gender questioning child you have to Wade through red tape, medical vocabulary at the same time as trying to understand what on earth is going on for your child. It’s time consuming, distressing and exhausting.
Fraida · 23/11/2020 23:47

@gardenbird48

the person he is talking about is 14!! They have been gaslit for years by trusted adults and friends that they are 'really' male and must therefore fix their body to match. I remember being 14 quite clearly and there was absolutely no way that I should ever have been allowed to make life changing decisions at that age (nor most of my peers) - that's why 14 year olds are children and the age of majority is not 14.

It must be luck of the draw on waiting times. Many cancer treatments and treatments for life limiting or altering conditions have huge waiting times so as wellthats points out there is no difference there.

The person I know who realised they were non binary seemed to get an appointment with the gender clinic during lockdown pretty much straightaway (either that or they realised they were nb after the gender clinic appt, I'm not sure) but they started taking testosterone 3 months later so hardly a significant amount of time considering the life changing impact of the treatment (which is already causing changes).

Bev Jackson makes such reasonable points about self-diagnosis and it is nice to see a non-derogatory reference to LGB Alliance (is this new DG Tim's influence?)

The person you know must have gone private as the child waiting list is now 3 years and the adult one even longer.
Fraida · 23/11/2020 23:46

@KiposWonderbeasts

My 14yo had to wait 2 weeks before I’d let her bleach her hair, ffs. Bollocks would I let her make life altering permanent medical decisions at that age! Why aren’t the parents advocating caution for their child?

With JM, do you think his garment choice when fox-bashing is why he’s so keen on this?

To be fair many of us are. Proceeding with caution is definitely my MO for my gender questioning child. It’s a myth that all parents of children with possible gender dysphoria are desperate to get to GIDs so we can shove hormones into them. Many of us just want the psychological support .
ChakaDakotaRegina · 23/11/2020 23:35

@Duckwit

He's retweeted a follower who is deeply swayed by the asinine observation that if someone wants to attack a woman in changing rooms they don't need trans rights to dress up as a woman to do so.

Ah yes the 'look ladies, blokes are gonna rape you anyway so we might as well just let anyone in anywhere and if you are not comfortable with that well I'm afraid that's just tough shit'.

Great, fucking thanks a lot!

How very t phobic! No one has to dress as a woman to enter a woman’s space because all identifies are valid and you are your identify. You cannot challenge anyone.

Is this person getting cancelled?

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 23/11/2020 23:27

As I’ve been reading Austin I will simply say that he does seem to be a deeply unpleasant man —keeping my swears for later—

Surely the “send people abroad for trans surgery” demand is only one step down from the crazy crazy Edinburgh Action for Trans Health “let us do our own surgery” demand Confused

littlbrowndog · 23/11/2020 23:09

He is such a tube. Laughed like a drain at that

That’s the insults we throw at our sibs

You are a tube

No you are a tube.

Sums up the privelged tube Maugham

WouldBeGood · 23/11/2020 23:06

Yes. Thanks, women 😊

Xanthangum · 23/11/2020 22:49

Honestly the women on here. Are the best. Ever

Agreed

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Duckwit · 23/11/2020 22:48

He's retweeted a follower who is deeply swayed by the asinine observation that if someone wants to attack a woman in changing rooms they don't need trans rights to dress up as a woman to do so.

Ah yes the 'look ladies, blokes are gonna rape you anyway so we might as well just let anyone in anywhere and if you are not comfortable with that well I'm afraid that's just tough shit'.

Great, fucking thanks a lot!

BernardBlackMissesLangCleg · 23/11/2020 22:37

God but Jolyon Maugham is such a tube

Grin Grin Grin

PersonaNonGarter · 23/11/2020 22:29

God but Jolyon Maugham is such a tube.

nauticant · 23/11/2020 22:27

He's retweeted a follower who is deeply swayed by the asinine observation that if someone wants to attack a woman in changing rooms they don't need trans rights to dress up as a woman to do so.

A QC writes: if people are going to break the law then I'm cool about relaxing it or doing away with it.

littlbrowndog · 23/11/2020 22:15

Great post weebisom

Honestly the women on here. Are the best. Ever

Following in the trail of past great women who fought this shite.

I never knew all this stuff. And now I feel strong from what I have learnt here.

Keep going 💪💪

WouldBeGood · 23/11/2020 22:14

@HecatesCats

I'm also agog at this white, straight, well educated, able bodied, middle class very privileged dude lecturing us about intersectionality. I"m sorry, but he's a tax lawyer!

So many white middle class dudes happy to call women privileged when it comes to trans rights. Almost as if they've resented women all along 🤔

I think this hits the nail on the head
ArcheryAnnie · 23/11/2020 22:13

@Lumene

TRAs have very dodgy sources of funding, so they accuse their political opponents of having dodgy sources of funding. etc etc.

Do they? Is there evidence of this?

Jennifer Pritzker, right-wing American billionaire, has given millions of dollars to transgender studies (weirdly enough a lot of it to Canada).

The other place Pritzker mainly donates money is, er, the American military.

HecatesCats · 23/11/2020 22:12

I'm also agog at this white, straight, well educated, able bodied, middle class very privileged dude lecturing us about intersectionality. I"m sorry, but he's a tax lawyer!

So many white middle class dudes happy to call women privileged when it comes to trans rights. Almost as if they've resented women all along 🤔

Ereshkigalangcleg · 23/11/2020 21:59

honestly think these people have their heads in the sand because it's actually deeply unpleasant and disturbing to think about how many perverted men there are out there.

Yes, it's the same version of the "Just World" fallacy that rape apologists fall back on. If anything did happen, they'd wave it away as a rare, isolated incident or try to use gotchas about lesbians and female violence.

OldCrone · 23/11/2020 21:52

@MaudTheInvincible

Lumene

Jennifer Bilek on Twitter is pretty good on this twitter.com/bjportraits/status/1330591811035930627?s=20

As far as I understand, much funding comes from people like Martine Rothblatt and Jennifer Pritzker. Also funding from pharmaceutical companies eg. Stryker Corp to Arcus Foundation and then back to Stryker Corp via medical bills. Also, the Kennedy Foundation who tried to denounce JKR in the summer have direct links to Denton's law firm, who are also involved in the Igylo document advising that laws such as self-id should be masked by covering them with popular laws such as marriage equality (Ireland given as an example). Igylo's ex-co chair is Anna Robinson who administers the UK government's LGBT All Party Parliamentary Group.

It's all very murky and incestous imo.

I first came across the term 'astroturfing' in this article which mentions Pritzker, Arcus etc:

sue-donym.medium.com/inauthentic-selves-the-modern-lgbtq-movement-is-run-by-philanthropic-astroturf-and-based-on-junk-d08eb6aa1a4b

WouldBeGood · 23/11/2020 21:47

It is relevant if true as he is very hot on conflict of interest for others.

Any personal interest in litigation should be declared and open.

WeeBisom · 23/11/2020 21:46

His first tweet is that the younger generation is, 'as a rule totally cool with being trans', and that the only people who are 'at odds' with the hip youth are older 'out of touch' people. This does not mesh with my experience at all. I know loads of students and young people who are deeply critical of certain aspects of trans ideology. Only one of my close female friends is really supportive of trans stuff, and even then she is willing to engage and is troubled by gender critical arguments (but ultimately resorts to 'they are vulnerable so it's the nice thing to do.) When you get young people in a physical space and actually let them talk without fear, the consensus seems to be that being trans is fine but things like males in sports, or self-ID law is troubling. So it's a bit of a red herring to make this seem like young people are totally on board.

I actually burst out laughing at his pompous "if you are a man and the reality of your engagement with equality issues is that you do little more than default to the views of a significant woman in your life, that doesn't make you woke, it makes you lazy." Right, Jo, and what kind of man does it make you when you never listen to the views of women, significant or not, ever?

I'm also agog at this white, straight, well educated, able bodied, middle class very privileged dude lecturing us about intersectionality. I"m sorry, but he's a tax lawyer! And he's basically saying you should be suspicious if the people you agree with are from an empowered class - doesn't that undermine the chorus of support from his own followers? If you agree with Jo Maugham that isn't exactly very 'intersectional'.

Also, this talk of 'tribes' is creepy and weird.

He's retweeted a follower who is deeply swayed by the asinine observation that if someone wants to attack a woman in changing rooms they don't need trans rights to dress up as a woman to do so. No, but self-ID greatly facilitates their access to these spaces. It should be possible to challenge a man in a dress in changing rooms. but self-ID actively states that his presence in that space is none of my business. I honestly think these people have their heads in the sand because it's actually deeply unpleasant and disturbing to think about how many perverted men there are out there. I used to know a very sweet, quiet and shy young man from work who...was arrested for filming women on the toilets. He was caught sneaking into an upscale establishment. You would never in a million years have suspected him of such a thing. And yet he had hundreds of these videos which he uploaded online, and he went to ever desperate lengths to capture them. Self-id, and those congratulatory signs on toilets saying someone's identity is none of our business, is an absolute dream for a person like him.

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