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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

"Transgender man, 34, loses legal battle to be named as the father on his child's birth certificate as Supreme Court refuses to hear his case"

460 replies

Malahaha · 16/11/2020 14:24

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8953783/Transgender-man-34-loses-legal-battle-named-father-childs-birth-certificate.html

Don't know if this was already posted but it's a glimmer of hope that soe judges have their heads screwed on tightly.

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RealityNotEssentialism · 17/11/2020 08:44

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TinselAngel · 17/11/2020 07:54

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RealityNotEssentialism · 17/11/2020 07:46

I think that there do need to be trans and NB specific rape services. The poster’s friend who has been assaulted and can’t get help has my sympathies and that is awful. Also, I wouldn’t be so sure that other users of a shelter would be super-accepting of a trans man. It’s more about whether a person passes for the opposite sex than what their chromosomal makeup is. Some trans men do pass, much more so that the majority of trans women. To the outside world they appear male and I don’t think female rape victims would be comfortable with them in a shelter and nor would they probably feel comfortable there. This is why specific provision would be a good thing.

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 17/11/2020 07:35

No fucking way am I using the male pronoun for someone who has just given birth.

It's a lie. It stands reality on its head.

Anyone else reminded of the Loretta sketch?

Gncq · 17/11/2020 07:35

our local rape crisis is inclusive of women,nb women and trans women, but do not provide services for anyone identifying as male - they are told to seek advice from services for men and boys.

Shock that's utterly disgraceful.

These services should be available to people based on their sex, seeing as the consequences of being raped when you have a female reproductive system are completely different to being raped when you have the same equipment used by the rapist, and the services provided (tests, examinations etc) are based on your actual physical body, not whether you feel feminine or masculine that day.

Also, having people with the reproductive equipment used for rape being in a rape crisis cente with people who have female reproductive organs is extremely detrimental to the wellbeing and recovery process of those people who have female reproductive organs.

NotBadConsidering · 17/11/2020 03:01

Interesting in those screen shots how Freddy says the Government lied about the GRA.

How would Freddy describe the action of telling the GRC panel their intention to “live as a man” then immediately get pregnant?

Freddy has done an amazing job of highlighting how “living as a man” and “living as a woman” are empty phrases that can’t be defined and as such, a GRC isn’t worth the paper it’s written on.

Butterer · 17/11/2020 00:43

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DeaconBoo · 17/11/2020 00:24

The people who make decisions in court are supposed to be disinterested. it's kind of the point. I really don't get their logic.

WeeBisom · 17/11/2020 00:19

I don't get Freddy's argument. They say that the birth certificate is not a record of biology but a record of legal parenthood. But legal parenthood is linked to biology. The legal 'mother' is the person who gives birth, and the legal 'father' is the person who contributes the sperm.You can't just change the definition of a legal label because you don't feel like it fits you. That would be like saying that you identify as legally single when in fact you are married, or legally as a child when you are over 18. I sympathise that Freddy feels they were lied to about the scope of the gender recognition act (weren't we all?) but it is clear in the act that the legal gender identity does NOT afford you every single legal benefit of the other sex and is subject to exceptions in the Equality Act.

BraveBananaBadge · 17/11/2020 00:02

What is he talking about in those screenshots? Really, what is he talking about? His child has been denied the right to an accurate birth certificate? No, they already have one of those. What he wants would certainly make it so.

The existing birth certificate could put the child in danger? It’s following a policy of (ahem) ^de facto sterilisation^ for trans people??!

He’s living in a fantasy world. It’s worrying and offensive.

WhataFarce76 · 16/11/2020 23:40

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OhHolyJesus · 16/11/2020 23:10

Yikes I missed the bit where Freddy is trying to get pregnant again. Lordy.

This was posted last week. Following the Seahorse documentary Freddy continues to live in the public domain.

"Transgender man, 34, loses legal battle to be named as the father on his child's birth certificate as Supreme Court refuses to hear his case"
OhHolyJesus · 16/11/2020 23:07

Dodgy screen shorting sorry, hope you can see.

It's now the child's identity not Freddy's.

"Transgender man, 34, loses legal battle to be named as the father on his child's birth certificate as Supreme Court refuses to hear his case"
"Transgender man, 34, loses legal battle to be named as the father on his child's birth certificate as Supreme Court refuses to hear his case"
"Transgender man, 34, loses legal battle to be named as the father on his child's birth certificate as Supreme Court refuses to hear his case"
Hoowhoowho · 16/11/2020 23:06

I think there’s an argument to change birth certificates to reflect reproductive technology.
Children deserve to know
A. Who provided the egg and the sperm that created them
B. Which women birthed them (the mother!)

At the moment a child can be born from embryo donation and their birth certificate does not reflect their genetic heritage at all.

Blueberries0112 · 16/11/2020 22:46

They can always call it this way:
Egg/Mtdna carrier:

Sperm/Y-DNA carrier:

But it's still a mother and father

RealityNotEssentialism · 16/11/2020 22:36

@OhHolyJesus

Just going to my ante-natal classes and popping my folic acid tabs. As a man.

In the Seahorse documentary Freddy explained that it was necessary for Freddy to remove the word 'pregnant' (or was it 'women'?) from the folic acid tablets Freddy was taking.

It might be worth watching that again now, given the context and the next IVF round that is underway.

Yikes I missed the bit where Freddy is trying to get pregnant again. Lordy.
DeaconBoo · 16/11/2020 22:26

I suggest Parent A and Parent 1.
Inclusive and clear!

TyroTerf · 16/11/2020 22:26

Makes sense. Word associations are quite a key factor in dysphoria, after all.

OhHolyJesus · 16/11/2020 22:17

Just going to my ante-natal classes and popping my folic acid tabs. As a man.

In the Seahorse documentary Freddy explained that it was necessary for Freddy to remove the word 'pregnant' (or was it 'women'?) from the folic acid tablets Freddy was taking.

It might be worth watching that again now, given the context and the next IVF round that is underway.

RealityNotEssentialism · 16/11/2020 21:09

Not sure I like the binary nature of the word ‘son’ there WhatAFarce76. I think something like ‘child assigned male at birth’ or maybe ‘non-binary offspring’ might help folx feel safer than the current wording does.

Ali85 · 16/11/2020 21:07

There is already a case v. similar to this from Germany that is pending before the ECtHR. It's mentioned in the Court of Appeal judgment in the McConnell case at para 73-78 www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2020/559.html Sounds like very similar case and court decision to McConnell.

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 16/11/2020 21:02

Re. the redacted rosary. I'm fucking crying!, and my sides hurt.

WhataFarce76 · 16/11/2020 20:56

Hail Mary, Full of Grace, The Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among CENSORED and blessed is the fruit of thy gestational organ, Jesus. Holy Mary, PARENT 1 of God, pray for us sinners now, and at the hour of death. Glory Be to PARENT 2, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit.

RealityNotEssentialism · 16/11/2020 20:51

@motorcyclenumptiness

The family courts are unbelievably 'woke'. So, I would imagine, is the ECHR. Can't see the ecthr as the forum that paves the way for motherless children - it would be disastrous for the court and the coe (coe's Catholic countries are unlikely to embrace the notion of 'Holy Mary parent 1 of God')
😆 at ‘parent 1 of God’

Oh holy Parent 2 who art in Heaven

Oblomov20 · 16/11/2020 20:42

No sympathy with Freddy, no agreement.

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