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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sweden: sharp decline in referrals to GD clinics

32 replies

NeurotrashWarrior · 16/11/2020 13:59

Very interesting report on the impact of the media on gender dysphoria.

genderreport.ca/the-swedish-u-turn-on-gender-transitioning/

*In the fall of 2019, there was a 65% decline in the number of referrals to gender clinics in Sweden. This corresponded with experts calling on the government to review clinical protocols and more balanced media coverage of the phenomenon of regret among gender transitioners, including the airing of a ”_.

The 3-part documentary includes several interviews with detransitioners and revealed that medical transition of minors is not evidence-based. A high profile transwoman in Sweden – Aleksa Lundberg – also came out in the media saying that if she were to go back and make the decision again “I might not have had the surgery””_. She said she had believed that “there was a more scientific basis” for this healthcare – but has since realized that that is not the case. She says people deserve “a more complex narrative” than the simple public narrative that the media has been promoting on the topic of gender transition.*

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nauticant · 18/11/2020 14:23

Powerful stuff. The parts that were particularly powerful:

  • the reporter asking decision makers (the decision being for gender reassignment surgery to be available to 15 year olds) where the evidence was for young trans people committing suicide if they cannot undergo the surgery and hearing them pause for a long time and try and retract in real time,
  • how when decision makers were asked to explain the evidence base for the whole thing it immediately starts to fall apart,
  • Aleksa Lundberg (well known transwoman in Sweden) being punished by trans activists and expelled from communities for expressing doubts about trans orthodoxy.
YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/11/2020 12:25

Thank you ANew!

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 18/11/2020 12:23

There is also a suggestion that school lockdown has coincided with a reduction of cases.

If you are wearing a mask most of the time does it matter if you have facial hair or lipstick? If your clubs and sports are halted because of the restrictions then does that reduce your feelings of discomfort in your own body? If you can't see your friends to compare body changes then are the body changes worth taking the cross sex hormones?

It will be very interesting to see this play out - it is transphobic to suggest there is an element of social contagion in gender dysphoria, but, that may need to be reexamined in light of these figures.

nauticant · 18/11/2020 12:21

Thanks very much!

ANewCreation · 18/11/2020 12:19

Here is the 3rd part - which is a pretty brief (15mins) update:
genderchallenge.no/onewebmedia/fortsattningen%20english.mp4

Plus a documentary from The Netherlands - not watched it yet but apparently good!

nauticant · 18/11/2020 12:08

I wondered the same and after having had a look and not finding it I assume 3 was an error.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/11/2020 11:58

Does anyone have a link to Part Three? I can't find this.

NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 21:34

Makes me think the surgeons were also taken in by all the documentaries too.

Plus 💰

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Socrates11 · 17/11/2020 17:45

This, from the first link just makes me so bloody cross. What do the care providers think they are doing? Evidence based practice should be a bloody given.

Unlike the epidemic of self-harm behavior, (gender dysphoria) care providers are not exploring to find the right treatment. Instead, on a broad front, drastic treatment with high doses of sex hormones and breast and genital surgery is introduced. This despite the lack of any scientific evidence for these treatments for children, and probably not for young adults either

Sven Roman, MD and child psychiatrist

PurpleHoodie · 17/11/2020 17:36

Good news.

NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 17:33

Watson also played out their yo yoing identities on screen via Sabrina. (I believe pushed for the character to become trans.)

Sabrina was a great show in the 90s; I doubt many parents would know about how this version plays out with this story.

I appreciate art; Orlan's surgeries to become an archetypal beauty and then to have 'horns' were interesting and extreme as 'art' for some.

My issue is that this is 'top surgery' normalised for young women and girls who don't understand the longer term impact. It's not a tattoo.

It's also Infantilising the female form.

Why does the non binary body default to male?

www.vogue.co.uk/miss-vogue/article/lachlan-watson-interview

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NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 17:26

Thanks merch that's really useful.

I've posted this link before; interestingly I couldn't see the images this time till I clicked on each one.

I wonder if the publishers recognise the issue? (Doubtful.)

I see these posts as glamourising a type of self harm. There can be damage to the glands under the arm through surgery causing long term drainage issues and pain.

How is this different to self harm images on Instagram?

www.refinery29.com/en-gb/2019/05/234065/lachlan-watson-top-surgery-scar-interview

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MerchedCymru · 17/11/2020 14:30

There is definitely a slow but sure shift happening with more clinicians being willing to speak out and more research evidence (and evidence of a lack of evidence) that supports a more considered, holistic 'watch and wait' approach.
The international Society for Gender-based Medicine are well worth keeping an eye on - the blog currently has articles about 'conversion therapy' and a rebuttal of previous 'evidence' about gender surgeries improving mental health. www.segm.org/
Clear, objective and evidence-based. A joy.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 17/11/2020 14:02

It is important isn't it?

It is. It needs to be seen.

TyroTerf · 17/11/2020 12:59

Excellent news, well done to the Swedes who've been shouting about this.

I always think of the social contagion thing as an issue of accessible analytical frameworks.

If "transgenderism" is the most immediately available, the only socially acceptable, framework accessible to them, then people learn to think of themselves in reference to it.

NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 12:44

Absolutely collide. Its becoming 'the norm' to do so.

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Collidascope · 17/11/2020 12:42

Gazing

NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 12:42

But don't get me started on how charities providing school resources have enabled this harm even more. Angry

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Collidascope · 17/11/2020 12:42

This seems to me another reason not to normalise stating your pronouns. The intention is to make gender identity a thing, of course, which encourages the navel-hazing social contagion element.

NeurotrashWarrior · 17/11/2020 12:41

It is important isn't it?

I think it's absolutely the crux and has been for a while.

My personal experiences of teaching a gender questioning pupil with asd was entirely based in media.

His personal interests were all from certain tween shows on satellite tv. He was just into the "wrong" clothes and toys. He had no expressions of being in the wrong body till that concept was introduced to him by an older child/ teen who had watched a documentary.

The films on YouTube for years have been of so many who essentially advertise and glamourise and then project their own experiences. Also tumblr, chat rooms etc.

There was a particular algorithm on youtube for a period of time that brought up similar videos to what you'd watched. It's been changed now (only a little!) as it was implicated in the increase of flat earthers and fake news.

It's the same processes described by Oliver James in 'the Affluenza Virus' whereby media, tv and advertising has been directly linked to rises in depression, anxiety and anorexia around the world. We can be very influenced by visual images.

We all know how ana sites and self harm images on Instagram have influenced vulnerable children and young people, especially girls.

For me though, the way women and girls are presented in all visual media now and in the past has a big part to play. Both through objectification and how girls react to that objectification. And porn too.

Girls don't have to actively seek this stuff out to be affected by it. It's everywhere.

And being trans and getting mastectomies has definitely been glamourised.

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YetAnotherSpartacus · 17/11/2020 12:24

This is fantastic. Please watch!

RuffleCrow · 17/11/2020 10:50

Great news! Let's share widely

ArabellaScott · 17/11/2020 10:46

This is really important, I think.

tinkerella1 · 17/11/2020 10:39

It’s a really interesting read.
I’m also interested in the way social media platforms and message boards have really clamped down on pro anorexia speech and effectively slowed the progression of those seeking affirmation of pro anorexia ideas. But they’ve actively promoted gender dysphoria to teens as an answer to their Autistic, ADHD and Anxiety disorders.

I’m really hoping that in the UK children’s charities look closely at the data coming from Sweden.

littlbrowndog · 16/11/2020 22:59

Bump

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