'To say that some men rape and sexually assault women and girls is an uncontroversial fact'

But 99.9% of the time the perpetrators are men not trans women.

Firstly, how do you know? You can't assume they're men just because they look like men, they could be any gender at all.

And secondly, you've missed the point. Which is that female-only spaces keep out all the male people, including all the lovely harmless male people, because this is the best way of reducing the opportunity for the bad male people to be there and have the access and opportunity, by making the presence of an unknown male person a warning sign that women and girls can act upon.

I don't mind the suggestion of self-defence classes for girls, I don't consider it victim-blaming or shifting responsibility, depending on the context, of course, and in this context she clarifies that's not what she's doing.

I think the point of self-defence classes is that it might work. A lot of opportunistic men might attack a girl or woman because they expect it to be easy and if the girl starts screaming, stamping, kicking back then the man might get a shock and let her go (and probably look for someone else, unfortunately).

Alternatively, the girl resisting and fighting back might make the man angry and he might become even more determined and punch/stab/kill you. If he does, it was not the girls fault for fighting back (though of course some men will try and claim it is. Women can't win, really).

There is no way of knowing which type of attacker you've got and whether freezing, or (trying to) fight or flight was the best, or least bad, option until after the attack. And even then, all 3 might have resulted in the same outcome.

Thanks HecatesCats. I thought that was the case. This quote from the article is apt:

Males as a group are reasonably excluded from these spaces in order to try to protect women and girls from a few of their number. We used to understand that; or better yet, we didn't used to pretend to misunderstand this.

But 99.9% of the time the perpetrators are men not trans women.

98% of sexual offences are committed by men.

Where is the evidence that transition (whether medicalized or not) has any effect on the offending rate of men who have become trans women?

@DrizzleandDamp

My rape was also a date rape and I'm sorry you feel like that. I don't feel the same way because what she said is still true - some men rape and sexually assault women. Unfortunately for you and me, that man was a man we trusted not to do that.

It is a fact that women are at risk of violence every time they are alone with a man. As a single women living alone, I am at a much lower risk of sexual violence than a woman living with a man.

I liked her blog post. I really liked how she did give passing mention to other issues like where she said that men are sexually assaulted too, but that’s not what she intends to address now. Its good to acknowledge when a crime affects others and then move on.

I really liked how she stated the facts- some men rape and sexually assault women and girls. I hate it when people generalise absolutely hate it- statements like “men are rapists”. Language is important to me and I respect a view point more when it’s expressed the way she did it with accurate bare facts stated simply. It takes a bare second to say “some men are rapists” after all and just that qualifier turns a sexist generalisation into an incontestable fact.

Siameasy
*So dreadful
Was the Sec 60 because people were angry and going out looking for the rapist?
Yes. The original video was posted on local Facebook groups, and from the comments it seemed people were intending to go and look for the perpetrator at specific addresse*s.

Oh well, can't have people taking the law into their own hands

That is such a good piece of writing. I would love to use this as the basis for a conversation with a Fourth Wave feminist. Or a TRA prepared to talk with someone like me.

I think one of the pivotal thoughts on the whole issue is that some people think that a Male wishing to transition into a Female, is the type of man who ISN’T one of those men who wishes to rape or perv on women. And some people think that the women who want to retain women-only spaces, think that a Male wishing to transition into a Female, IS the type of man who wants to rape or perv on women. I believe neither of those things.

To some women, it’s like any man that genuinely wishes to live life ‘as’ a woman, automatically eradicates any Male tendency within themselves to sexual violence against women. Or there might be an acceptance that in the ‘very rare cases’ someone who is transgender and perpetrates such a crime, is not REALLY transgender.

And you end up in a loop of both ‘Not all men are rapists’, ‘trans people aren’t perverts’ and so on and so on...

And all I’m saying, and seemingly Stock is saying is, ‘let’s lower the opportunity for the ‘exceptions to the rules’ and the ‘very rare cases’, to have access to vulnerable women and girls in the first place. Let’s make the women and the girls our priority because they’re the ones most at risk here.

That’s it isn’t it??

Was the Sec 60 because people were angry and going out looking for the rapist?

I think so. His image was also shared via sm to warm other local parents.

drizzle

I know how you feel. Mine was a stranger but I was drunk so also v much internalised the blame.

It's awful really, having to use rape stories in an argument to secure very basic rights for women and girls. I want to post this article on FB but last time I posted about women's rights I had to watch a friend & a male acquaintance give each other woke brownie points in the comments. It felt devastating. A purely academic argument for them. But my reality.

It’s an excellent post but I’ve read it and feel cold, because my horrific attack was a date rape and so it feels like my fault I went.

I know it isn’t, but the idea that it’s only mixed spaces or grabbed off the streets makes rapes from known men somehow excluded, and they are the majority and the hardest to prosecute.

Just brilliant. Thank you, Kathleen.

Even as a young woman I was aware of the danger of males. I backpacked for quite some time in South America and Asia and the number of times I barely escaped assault doesn't bear thinking about. I quickly learned to adapt my behaviour: never to travel alone, wear clothing appropriate to the culture, etc. Doing so is never victim blaming, and I'm so glad she made that clear.

I knew from a young age to avoid being in any space where a strange man could have access to me. Even then, it was unavoidable. Try walking down a street in a foreign country and having male passersby openly grabbing your boobs (one after the other!) , or shoving his hand into your crotch from behind as you get into a bus, or breaking into your (cheap) hotel room. Or being propositioned just because you were not travelling with your husband or brother. Assuming you are there just for the taking.

So yes, I was never one for mixed-sex facilities, even in my carefree youth.

I should maybe have name-changed for this as I've spoken of these things elsewhere under my real name but frankly, I'm getting tired of hiding.

Yesterday I also saw a piece about how responses to J.K. Rowling’s recent interventions about women’s rights have exposed a “generational divide”. Young people tend to reject her views about, say, the importance of single-sex spaces for women, whilst older people tend to embrace them. Well no shit, Sherlock! Young people are.... young. They haven’t been on the planet for very long. For this reason, they lack detailed information about patterns of behaviour in the world. They put personal experiences down to being one-offs, rather than seeing them as part of larger systems. This is not their fault - it’s normal for their stage of development. But this lack of information also makes them susceptible to magical thinking and unrealistic optimism. To put it crudely, many kids still believe in a fairy tale: that a male declaring he is a woman makes something magic happen, which means that from that point on, all general male-related safeguarding structures are irrelevant. I used to think this too when I was younger. But then I left Neverland.

It's an excellent blog post. This paragraph particularly.

Gah - that should read "summarises what so many of us ask others who disagree with the GC view, to consider.

Excellent read, thanks OP. This paragraph has really struck out at me and I think summarises what so many of us try of other posters on these boards -

The short answer is: I don’t know. In some people, there seems to be an automatic demotion of the interests/feelings/safety of women and girls which isn’t so much rational as pathological. If you are one of these people, reading this, chances are your brain is right now firing off distracting rejoinders at a rate of knots: “what about trans women at risk of attack in male bathrooms?” “what about trans men misgendered in women’s changing rooms?”; “are you saying all trans women are predators?”; “won’t some women just get raped anyway?”. In which case I ask you, in turn: what is it that makes you go to those questions first? Why can’t you stick with the subject, even for a minute? Why does the dramatically imagined plight of a trans person forced to use the “wrong” changing room somehow always seems a lot worse to you than the plight of a sexually assaulted woman or girl, or one who reasonably fears she might be? Why don’t you feel her panic rising, not to mention her physical pain? Why can’t you imagine her nightmares afterwards? Why can’t you think of her future, newly reconstructed with places she can’t easily go, and things she can’t easily remember?

I really like Kathleen Stock. I don't think the trans element will persuade anyone who isn't already very GC though. The suggestion that trans women may be sexual predators has been debated to death and I can't see this this blog post changing anyone's mind who believes TWAW.

Every woman does indeed have a list of incidents that have happened at the hands of men. (Sorry to hear of your Mum's experience Rufus that's truly awful). But 99.9% of the time the perpetrators are men not trans women.

The attack happens because the attacker decided to use his superior strength and social capital to take advantage of a woman.

So dreadful
Was the Sec 60 because people were angry and going out looking for the rapist?

Excellent piece. And infuriating. That poor girl.

That happened to my mum

She was dragged into an alley and rescued by a man and woman

Its a fantastic blog post

That is excellent. Brava Ms Stock.

Spot on tweet:

Kathleen Stock @Docstockk
4 Nov
The video of the attempted abduction of a young girl is beyond upsetting but I hope it reminds the cossetted, financially insulated performance artists arguing for gender neutral public spaces think twice about what they are giving away in the name of “social justice”.

(Responses saying “it happened in the street” “it will happen anyway” and “my bathroom at home is gender neutral” will be ridiculed as moronic jokers.)