Women win guarantee over female only public lavatories - the Times

Glad to hear you're celebrating, Facefull.

And yes, agree what you describe sounds like transphobia, which does exist but has now become a term so ridiculously overused that it's almost lost all meaning.

@ChattyLion

Facefull I’m sorry that you had to deal with all of that at such a young age (or at any age, ever).

You know I mentioned that talking about this stuff is good for reflection and working out overlaps and interlinking things?

I spent last night thinking about the other person I knew IRL who said they experienced horrendous lesbophobia from their family at a young age. They told their dad when they were 9/10 that they were a lesbian.

Their dad's reaction was to punch them.
It's obviously fucking horrendous.

I am uneasy about it being labelled as simply lesbophobia - it was the experience Karen Jones told me they had, when we were talking about experiences of growing up gay/knowing before puberty that we were attracted to women, before I knew who they were. I would absolutely describe it as transphobia - it is underpinned with lesbophobia only if you are using the TWAW narrative.
And I am in no shape or form condoning or justifying Karen's father's reaction.

Ties in with not distinguishing between lesbian women and trans lesbian women's experiences, I think?

A related thread I started a week or so ago:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4058470-the-big-lie-how-the-wep-was-always-about-gender-rather-than-sex

Wow, Escape that's interesting.

Hear, Hear, Escape.

And this bullshit about feminist organisations being fully on board with the erosion of sex exceptions in the Equality Act is nonsense. This stance by WEP has decimated their support. Fully two thirds of paying founder members have left since it started and they are limping along on handouts from a woke dude bro friend of the high up lib fems to meet the monthly payroll.

I think it's very telling that you see the testimony of gender nonconforming lesbians discussing how the behaviour of some people towards them in single sex spaces impacts on them as one big joke.

I think it's very telling that you jj1968 hear, read and see the testimony of rape survivors, trauma victims, old women, young women and girls, gender non conforming women, lesbians, disabled women, women adhering to their religion and dismiss them out of hand, it's no joke to them that they are effectively prevented from accessing public spaces to live their lives. They clearly matter not to you, you are quite happy for them to be unable or unwilling on the grounds of safety, privacy and dignity to access the services that were set up for THEM to do so.

Your dismissal of women and their needs disgusts me. Let no-one ever forget that you think Karen White has some kind of right to use female toilets and changing rooms, even more than that you believe that Karen White should be welcomed with open arms into such places.

Yes, Asking, quite.

I'm sure you'd find a huge amount of condition amongst the public if you really drilled down into it. That's why Stonewall have opted for stealth and no debate, so the confusion provides cover for policy shifts, Anecdotally speaking I've noticed that people I talk to are confused about the meaning of Transman and Transwoman, assuming that the former refers to male people who have transitioned to female and the latter to female people who have transitioned to male.

Bears repeating.

Women: 'we want and need to keep our single sex spaces'

TRAs: 'you can't have them'

Confusion not condition

I'm sure you'd find a huge amount of condition amongst the public if you really drilled down into it. That's why Stonewall have opted for stealth and no debate, so the confusion provides cover for policy shifts, Anecdotally speaking I've noticed that people I talk to are confused about the meaning of Transman and Transwoman, assuming that the former refers to male people who have transitioned to female and the latter to female people who have transitioned to male.

Hmm, if we accept your posturing, which I don't personally, I wonder if most women and feminists would still agree with you if they knew that the vast majority of transwomen hold on to their penises.

Surveys suggest they don't.

Women will be guaranteed access to female-only lavatories in public buildings, the government has said.

Wonderful news.

That's funny because I've taken to hopping over the long lectures as they were looking like system duplications before the system even started to do that, so your textbook phrase worked on me, looked like a direct quote.

I have no pity, all this whataboutery we are served up here just proves it's not needed.

No just clarifying Escape. I felt slightly bad for our friend - my female conditioning and all that

I feel duty bound to admit that 'no laughing matter' wasn't a direct quote from our learned friend, but rather paraphrasing from the 'How to refuse to take no for an answer' textbook they seem to be using.

Clearly I wasn't replying to you was I Floisme? Unless you think a post landing below yours is always a reply to you even though posters have no control at all over post position?

It seems that misogyny I am referring to comes from being born a penis person.

(blame Amnesty for this new inclusive language)

Just a reminder to jj. I don't recall any women who wishes to keep their spaces for women only suggesting 'gender cops' being parked outside of toilets.

What I have seen is thousands of tweets and many articles from 'SOME' of those activating for male access to women's toilets using this as an empty 'gotcha'. It fails to acknowledge a large number of things, like women's rightful concerns, but also fails to acknowledge history and RESPECT.

Historically women had the freedom to challenge someone who should not have been in there. If there was more than one women that is. Usually a women alone may simply leave without starting a potentially violent reaction. It used to be that was all it took and anyone outside might hear the commotion and come to assist.

The only reason 'gender cops' would ever be needed would be due to the complete lack of respect a male (penis person) has over a female single sex space and need to be officially ejected. Not because of women being at fault, because of males (penis people) who cannot respect a woman's boundaries.

But do crack on talking about 'gender cops' and 'genital inspections'. The derision that it evokes frankly adds to anyone who claims this's misogyny.

This is no laughing matter.

Pompous arse. You are the laughing matter, you've made yourself one right here.

'This is no laughing matter.'

Unlike this thread, which is like a casebook on how to scold a woman.