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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I am being asked to go into a meeting and introduce my pronouns to everyone in an hour and a half!

312 replies

WhatTheFuckHappenedHere · 29/10/2020 11:35

I am part of a work group tasked with running a big event that will take almost a year to plan. The first meeting is in an hour and a half over Zoom. The organiser, who I've never met, and goes by they/them pronouns according to the email signature, sent round an email reminder this morning with the meeting link, and including an agenda. The first thing on it is to introduce ourselves, our work area, an our gender pronouns. I don't really want to do this, but I need to work with this person and the group as a whole for the best part of a year! I'm feeling like I'll just have to go along with it lest I get accused of enacting literal and actual violence. Any advice?

OP posts:
FannyCann · 29/10/2020 12:58

The instructions also have some dictats relating to 'self care' during Zoom meetings, although hilarious, I dare not post these in case I'm horrendously outed

According to Twitter, post Jeffrey Toobin self care instructions now include a reminder not to masturbate. Blush

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 29/10/2020 12:56

"My pronouns are Boutros/Boutros/Ghali'.

Eth eth eth.

Coffeecak3 · 29/10/2020 12:56

dyke

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 29/10/2020 12:54

El Presidente

"My pronouns are Boutros/Boutros/Ghali" Grin

Coffeecak3 · 29/10/2020 12:54

@CaptainCorellisPangolin at the upcoming meeting you really should reference this.
Hello, I'm Pangolin or some of you may know me by xxx's description as that goddam fucking duke!

CaptainCorellisPangolin · 29/10/2020 12:51

We have a meeting coming up at work where we're expected to do this. It's been suggested by a newly identifying trans woman at work and has been rather hurriedly been picked up by management who, after months of arguments over toilets, discrimination and acceptable work clothes, are quite eager to keep them onside.
I plan to just ignore it. What people call me in my absence is up to them. According to other colleagues, the trans woman (who I've worked with for several years as a rather unpleasant man) has, on occasion, referred to me in my absence as "that goddamn fucking dyke".
So he or they would be a bit of a step up, frankly.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 29/10/2020 12:50

But surely if there’s someone in the meeting with pronouns other than you might expect, it’s less likely other meeting participants will remember them if you have to go round everyone else’s first which will just make people tune out or get confused.

That's a very good point, actually. For some reason, I'm reminded of an old satire/comedy sketch - can't remember the show, but it was a Chris Morris/Steve Coogan-type one - where a manager wanted to draw attention to the the fact that, one year, they had had a fatal accident in the facility. However, instead of saying that somebody had died in 1983, he insisted on saying "1975: no-one died; 1976: no-one died; 1977: no-one died; 1978: no-one died....... 1983: someone died". And that was intentionally written in a tediously annoying way for comic effect.

Just highlight to me the relevant part and ignore the other 99% of unremarkable details that are exactly as I'd expect.

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 29/10/2020 12:50

This is my hill to die on. It actually is traumatising to me, and it irks me no end that my sense of comfort and the prioritising of a non-threatening environment of inclusivity should constantly be ridden roughshod over whilst someone else's (some metaphorical person who likely isn't even present) takes precedence.

I've fought this kind of gender nonsense, not being promoted as quickly as men, etc, for the entirety of my working life. I've been subject to protracted sexual harrassment in that same workplace - a complaint they upheld - a situation that ended with my becoming seriously unwell and diagnosed with cPTSD because of former sexual abuse, plus stalking and rape. Because men for whatever reason (entitlement and a sense of rights) just simply cannot leave women alone.

I do not want to draw attention to my pronouns, or shine a spotlight on my gender or my sex-based oppression. I don't even want to 'weaponise my trauma', to coin a disgusting phrase, although if backed into a corner I will do precisely that, and will not be told how I can and cannot talk about issues which affect me. I want to be left alone.

If anyone chose to pressurise me or tried making me feel uncomfortable in such a situation I'd firmly request that they stop and escalate it immediately to HR. And it's coming. I work in that kind of organisation.

This shit is just not on, and it makes me blaze that people are being put under this kind of pressure or else implicitly risk being labelled a bigot. It's outrageous. It's also tedious. Really, who has the fucking time for fighting battles like this?

RHTawneyonabus · 29/10/2020 12:48

What about

I’m gender-free but happy for people to use sex-based pronouns

listsandbudgets · 29/10/2020 12:47

Another thought is you cold come up with something utterly ludicrous.. "my name is whatthefuck, my job responsibility is running the world and I identify as a panda so please refer to me as such for example "panda was right"

Wiredforsound · 29/10/2020 12:46

Captain Knobhead 😂😂😂

WhatTheFuckHappenedHere · 29/10/2020 12:45

It's so pathetic when people have their own obvious agenda to draw massive attention to themselves whilst pretending that they care about everybody. All this person needs to do is to introduce themselves and say "Just to let you know, my preferred pronouns are 'they/them'" and leave it at that.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll I think that’s what has annoyed me the most about it!

OP posts:
EstuaryBird · 29/10/2020 12:45

Tell them that you don’t want to impose the use of restrictive pronouns as you know that some people find certain pronouns offensive. You are happy for them to use the pronouns that they find appropriate for you.

If that is too much for them to cope with then they are free to refer to you as ‘it’ or ‘that’.

ListeningQuietly · 29/10/2020 12:44

If I am pressed to give myself a Title
(they are expecting Ms Mrs or Miss)
I always reply
El Presidente

If I was asked for a pronoun, I think I'd probably reply
Um
as that is what is usually said before people's names during meetings
Grin

Scarby9 · 29/10/2020 12:44

@goannaforanna
What about saying your proniuns are she/him?
You could go further and request
She / him / her / their then put in a complaint when they make an error in the dative or ablative (O level Latin coming in hsndy there!).

f0stercarer · 29/10/2020 12:43

let us know how it goes !

MitziK · 29/10/2020 12:43

Ooh, were I to have that delightful prospect, I think I'd book my next beautician appointment for afterwards.

The prospect of somebody saying to a woman (me) with a quarter inch long beard regrowth 'and what are your pronouns?' would get me out of another interminable zoom meeting pretty sharpish.

roarfeckingroarr · 29/10/2020 12:40

Read this to DP. His response: what total bollocks. Tell her to say her pronouns are "captain knobhead".

RuffleCrow · 29/10/2020 12:39

Just introduce yourself and say you're happy for others to use whatever pronouns they feel are appropriate for you. Say you're not one for putting words in other people's mouths. Stand firm.

listsandbudgets · 29/10/2020 12:39

Most forms have a "prefer not to say" option so I suppose you could say "My name is whatthefuck, my job responsibility is running the world and I prefer not to tell you my gender, thank you "

bluebluezoo · 29/10/2020 12:38

If pressed, i don’t identify with any gender. I am biologically female.

Use whatever pronouns you want.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 29/10/2020 12:36

Unconscious bias and stereotype threat.

carooCarou · 29/10/2020 12:35

www.shma.co.uk/our-thoughts/can-employers-prefer-to-put-pronouns-in-email-signatures/

This might be helpful op. If it's a video call I'd probably ignore it. If they asked I'd act confused and possibly a bit offended and say "isn't it obvious". Behind the scenes I would talk to hr or manager and say I am against this as I believe it encourages confirmation bias (I think that's the term) against women, and that it could put undue pressure on those who are struggling with their gender identity.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 29/10/2020 12:35

Y Webuilt.
You could even have ‘any pronoun requests’ as an agenda item. But surely if there’s someone in the meeting with pronouns other than you might expect, it’s less likely other meeting participants will remember them if you have to go round everyone else’s first which will just make people tune out or get confused.

Eckhart · 29/10/2020 12:32

'My name is ---. Call me what you like.'?