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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

School insists skirt is too short

168 replies

yesterdaystotalsteps123 · 22/10/2020 08:37

Dd doesn't like wearing trousers and has been told her skirt from Y6 that still fits her is too short. Fair enough I ordered a sensible one from Amazon, it is just above her knees and school are still saying it's too short! Wtf?? How can I address this?

OP posts:
eggandonion · 23/10/2020 13:45

My kids went to a coed secondary, not in the UK, but with similar uniform rules to moan about.
All subjects available to boys and girls, both my daughters have STEM degrees and careers,
My main gripe was mixed PE classes (not mixed team sports). It seemed to me that a lot of girls opted out as soon as possible - not wanting to bounce around in front of other girls and especially other boys. (They did a set of classes in self defence just for girls).

JurgenKloppsCat · 23/10/2020 13:21

Fortunately, such oppressive misogynistic structures do not seem to be affecting girls' attainment in schools in terms of the things that really matter. Is The Patriarchy losing sight of the Primary Objective?

RoyalCorgi · 23/10/2020 13:10

I bet the boys took over an entire playground for football though, didn't they?

They certainly did at my DD's school, and that was only 10 years ago.

OverTheRainbow88 · 23/10/2020 13:06

Policy states "skirts should finish at or below the knee" hers was just above

There we go, it’s not in line with the school uniform policy.

Dreading2020sSeasonFinale · 23/10/2020 12:52

Sorry, clicked post accidentally.

My SIL however is the complete opposite. She hates trousers. She owns some jeans but never wears them.

Dreading2020sSeasonFinale · 23/10/2020 12:50

@Badbanana

Strange, I’ve never met any woman/girl who had a complete aversion to wearing trousers? Is it a sensory issue?

Her choice, obviously, and it sounds like the school are being petty if they are saying past her knee is too short.

But trousers are infinitely more practical/comfortable. I don’t think any of DD’s friends have ever worn a skirt at school. But then they are all sporty types that like to play football at break time.

I haven't worn a skirt in 20 years. I hate them. I'm extremely self conscious about my tree trunk legs.

lazylinguist · 23/10/2020 12:40

It is perfectly possible to have a uniform or dress code which specifies things like no spaghetti straps, no skirts above the knee etc without being of the opinion that 'girls' thighs are immoral'. Midriffs aren't immoral but neither boys'nor girls' midriffs tend to be allowed to be visible in school uniform. Inappropriate for school or the workplace is not the same as 'immoral'.

The fact is that school uniforms tend to have less flexibility for boys than girls. Most secondary schools don't allow shorts for boys, only long trousers, yet girls are allower to wear trousers or skirts. Expecting them to be knee-length does not seem particularly unreasonable to me.

SoulofanAggron · 23/10/2020 12:11

Policy states "skirts should finish at or below the knee" hers was just above

@yesterdaystotalsteps123 Well then. It might seem picky but it seems they can see the difference. So, her skirt needs to be at or below the knee like in the rules.

MitziK · 23/10/2020 12:00

@yesterdaystotalsteps123

Yes Emily, bit it's mm here, and when have policies never been sexist and need challenging? From the school to the workplace to working life and family life, females are treated differently and usually unfairly. These skirt policy rules are rooted in the idea that 11 year old girls thighs are immoral in some unspecified way. She had zero thigh on show anyway, but in my experience secondary schools are desperate to close the attainment gap between boys and girls and have different leeways with boys than girls in terms of behaviour and schemes of work and exams, rewards and engagement strategies are often geared towards boys and their typical interests. But anyway I will speak to school today because the skirt rests slightly above her kneecap not showing any leg above the kneecap. Ffs. It is ridiculous
But with tights on underneath and the inevitable friction between the two materials, it won't be anywhere near the already too short position it is when she stands up when she moves around normally. It'll be halfway to her backside.
DidoLamenting · 23/10/2020 11:41

@drspouse

So far as playing , I'm not sure what "rough play " you have in mind for primary children. At my primary school in the 60s it was complex skipping games and hopscotch. I bet the boys took over an entire playground for football though, didn't they? Though they hopefully wouldn't be allowed to do that now,
It was many years ago but no recollection of that. The communal skipping games with long ropes took up a fair amount of space.

All of you who think any activity is impossible in a skirt- what do you think girls did before trousers became commonplace- especially girls like me growing up on a farm?

emilyfrost · 23/10/2020 11:27

Why is it sexist?

Speak to the school all you want, but all that’s ridiculous is your own overreaction and imagining problems that aren’t there to suit your own narrative.

yesterdaystotalsteps123 · 23/10/2020 11:22

Yes Emily, bit it's mm here, and when have policies never been sexist and need challenging? From the school to the workplace to working life and family life, females are treated differently and usually unfairly. These skirt policy rules are rooted in the idea that 11 year old girls thighs are immoral in some unspecified way. She had zero thigh on show anyway, but in my experience secondary schools are desperate to close the attainment gap between boys and girls and have different leeways with boys than girls in terms of behaviour and schemes of work and exams, rewards and engagement strategies are often geared towards boys and their typical interests. But anyway I will speak to school today because the skirt rests slightly above her kneecap not showing any leg above the kneecap. Ffs. It is ridiculous

OP posts:
emilyfrost · 23/10/2020 10:46

Policy states "skirts should finish at or below the knee" hers was just above plus she was wearing thick tights.

That’s the problem, then. It’s considerably likely this was the policy when you sent her to that school so you’ve always been fully aware.

It doesn’t matter if “it doesn’t sit right” with you; that’s the rule and you need to follow it.

itsalwaystimeforwine · 23/10/2020 10:11

does seem very sexist, are the boys at the school allowed to wear shorts? my DS is allowed to wear shorts at his secondary school, but the girls rules are much stricter which is definitely an issue! although DS does go to a private school so I guess they may be stricter

eggandonion · 23/10/2020 09:46

My daughter had a male year head who referred to it as skirts up to high heaven. These were paired with a v neck jumper, top shirt button undone, and ties adjusted so they were not visible, hidden under the jumper.
Girls who wore trousers had to wear grey socks with them, boys never had specific socks.
Every item was in nasty fabric.

NotFrozen · 23/10/2020 09:45

OP the solution is to buy a longer skirt.

MitziK · 23/10/2020 09:44

I'd like to say short skirts aren't a problem.

But when I've seen considerably more of teenage girls than I would ever want to see when they have sat down, reached up or walked upstairs, I've got to say I now go along with the rules on skirt length.

If I wore a skirt as short and the kids saw as much of me as I went about my job as I have involuntarily seen on some of them, I'd be fired and probably on a register.

caughtalightsneeze · 23/10/2020 09:44

And you accept that?! Where do you live, the 1920s?

I can't challenge it because she doesn't want to wear them. I challenged it when I was a pupil at the same school 25 years ago, so I'm not spineless. Didn't get anywhere though!

It's N Ireland. I've never seen a secondary school girl in trousers. I'm not saying there aren't any, maybe there are. But if you walk round Belfast city centre on a Friday afternoon when the teenagers go for a wander round the shops and there are thousands of them in school uniform (in non Covid times obviously) you don't see any girls in trousers. There definitely aren't any schools within travelling distance of where I live where girls are allowed to wear trousers.

EdwardCullensBiteOnTheSide · 23/10/2020 09:41

I was at secondary school in the 90s and the fashion then was rolling your skirt band so that your skirt was quite a bit above the knee! Paired with over knee socks. Strict Catholic school, I remember in assembly our permanently angry headteacher telling the girls we needed to come to school dressed like decent girls and not like ladies of the night!

Enko · 23/10/2020 09:28

Dies she roll her skirt? So what to you looks like a sensible above the knee skirt to the school is a belt? I live near 4 secondary schools and I would estimate 98% of the girls roll their skirts. Plenty also unroll before coming home.

As for trousers being more comfortable I am another one who much prefer skirts. & I have ever got why anyone find jeans comfortable and at age 50 do not own a pair (nor of leggings as dont find them comfortable wither)

drspouse · 23/10/2020 09:24

So far as playing , I'm not sure what "rough play " you have in mind for primary children. At my primary school in the 60s it was complex skipping games and hopscotch.
I bet the boys took over an entire playground for football though, didn't they?
Though they hopefully wouldn't be allowed to do that now,

TeenPlusTwenties · 23/10/2020 09:23

But if girls flout the rules more than boys, they need to be 'policed' more.
If her skirt had met the rules (did it not give the overall length in the info?) there wouldn't have been an issue.

VirginiaWolverine · 23/10/2020 09:21

DD regularly climbs very high trees in skirts and dresses. I wear leggings or tracksuit bottoms for actual exercise, but for day to day activities (climbing up things, bending, anything that involves a big stride or wide stance) I find a skirt or dress far less restrictive than trousers not specifically designed for sport.

I find trousers uncomfortable, but very practical for lower leg protection from thorns and nettles, so that's the sort of situation where I'd plan to wear them.

I think that maybe women who have a body shape that works with trousers don't realise just how uncomfortable they are for those who don't. I don't own a pair of trousers smart enough to wear outside the house or gym which fit my waist, hips and leg length.

yesterdaystotalsteps123 · 23/10/2020 09:16

I posted because I'm on the side of policing girls more than boys is a problem in schools. Maybe some schools started off with the "short skirts are distracting" argument but no they couldn't get away with that now, yet these policies are still kept. I remember the school shoes adverts a few months ago where the gender differences were highlighted by the kind of shoes girls and boys wear, so I do think this school's uniform policy re skirts is rooted in how society views girls' bodies. But yes I also quickly ordered it off Amazon for next day delivery so she could wear a skirt to school this week so there was no trying on.

OP posts:
AntiHop · 23/10/2020 08:58

How can girls run or walk if there skirt is actually over their knee?

@yesterdaystotalsteps123 by wearing any skirt that isn't a pencil skirt!

My dd is a lot younger than yours but loves climbing, running and being active. She loves wearing skirts and dresses, which don't stop her.

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