Joe Biden issues new statement on the transgender debate

Here I am, still laughing. Keep it up, girls! :D

Well yes, it's fairly obvious you have done little more than skimmed this thread. And yet here you are.

"I am not aware of any American feminists supporting Trump, but apparently he's a hit here for some reason."

Yes, the idea of Trump supporting feminists is a whole new level of crazy that I think few will have patience for right now. I've been skimming the thread for entertainment value though; we all need more laugh in our lives.

Sorry Bovary I had missed your getting called a troll.

What a state we are in.

I'm not American so not going to comment as anything but a cheesed off onlooker. But I do think characterizing the women here saying "Trump is a terrible human being but I'm not sure about how the hegemony of the two establishment elite parties can be resolved", as them finding Trump 'a hit', is a bit wide of the mark.

I do think if you take Trumps personality out of it and just look at policies I think he has America at the heart of everything.
The US seems to have been booming. Covid aside.
Biden seems to be more about others countries and helping them out than what he can do for the average American.
He supports the under dog even if that underdog is at odds and against a cause/another underdog he has said he supports.

He can’t say he supports Women’s Rights and then say he will reverse all “anti trans“ executive orders.

He has to choose one and it looks like women will lose out.

Certainly not trying to silence anyone - I posted for a little balance in terms what I think are the important issues for most Americans I know - and I know a lot. I am not aware of any American feminists supporting Trump, but apparently he's a hit here for some reason.

I'm surprised that the US politics discussions on this forum so quickly lurch rightwing/libertarian and convey such a sense of hopelessness.

But if you find it helpful, go for it.

Hey cheers @DidoLamenting and @BlackWaveComing! Appreciate it.

Something she said struck me ; she said she found more open-mindeness in a conservative Mormon university than she did in either Harvard or Cambridge

Great post. That is a very interesting point and it is discussed in Haidt's book The Coddling of the American Mind in relation to events on campus in 2017. Haidt cites startling statistics about the overwhelming left wing bias which dominates social science and arts departments. This has always existed, but it has become much more pronounced since the 1990s, with ratios of 17 to 1 leaning left. He attributes this to the 'Great Generation' of professors retiring. Many of those had fought in WW2 and entered academia as a result of grants designed to help veterans. They included Republicans and Conservatives thus guaranteeing a bulwark against group think, confirmation bias and political monotheism. That has been obliterated and now US campuses are dominated by an increasingly intolerant, rigid orthodoxy which is antithetical to freedom of speech, freedom of debate, academic rigour.

As Haidt says, this stultifying environment produces witch hunts. Evergreen for example. During the events at Evergreen, only one Professor apart from Brett Weinstein's wife publically supported him. Mike Paros, in Veterinary Science. This is a demonstration of one of Haidt's point about academic witch hunts; people who know the accused is innocent of often fabricated charges remain silent.

wrongstory I don’t think any of us are expecting to change the vote of any Americans. And the priorities of people outside America are bound to be different to people living there: just as the priorities of Americans living in eg New York will differ from those living in depressed rural idaho. However, we are still allowed to discuss it.

But tell me, if Biden is so keen on science then why is he agreeing to give in to the fake ‘science’ offered by transideology? If he is so keen on women’s rights then why destroy them by defining ‘women’ to mean men too.

Trump is a character who is easy to dislike. His demeanour, tweets, speeches and general behaviour are awful. But we do need to look beyond this at what are the actual political outcomes. What has he achieved through intent or otherwise? What is Biden likely to achieve through intent of otherwise? From speaking to my American (distant) relatives I don’t get the impression many people actually do this - most seem set that their side is good and the other side is bad and that is that.

The threads on U.S. politics on this forum are just wild - and depressing.
I have a lot of American friends desperate for Biden and other Democrats to win. They are writing postcards, voting early, making calls, donating. They aren't just saying suck it up and they aren't uncritical of everything that has gone before.
The issues that concern them (and Biden's positions, they believe, are preferable are);
Healthcare (don't cut the ACA)
Belief in science (handling of the pandemic)
Climate Change
Women's Rights (Roe v. Wade, etc.)
Economic fairness (cut the billionaire tax breaks)
Place on the world stage (don't cosy up to dictators)
Presidential character (is Trump fit to be president)
You may disagree with the stances on these issues but they are out there.

It's good to read a variety of news sources and also double-check your facts. But neither Trump or Biden are unknowns to the American public so if someone is still undecided at this point, I'm not sure they can be convinced, so it's more a matter of getting the vote out.

My friends are terrified of another four years of this and want a unifying figure in the White House. Some are actually feeling some cautious hope because there are some promising signs from the (never to be fully trusted again) polls and some of the senate races are pulling close. It's really easy just to be negative and say isn't everyone crap - when they aren't.

Thanks Wildswim interesting interview but at the same time not new - clarifying what we know. But also at odds with what people might expect - the ‘left’ (democrats) representing the wealthy and the ‘right’ (republicans) representing the poor. I wonder if this is because the poor see the right as providing a means to climb out of being poor but the left as just making being poor a bit more comfortable?

take your pick
or shut up

Yeah, this isn't generally proving to be the most successful tactic for persuasion, is it? I mean, either you genuinely hate Trump and are just showing yourself as rude and unpleasant, or you are a secret Trump plant trying to make the Dems look bad.

Politics should be about the issues. We should debate the policies and actions of candidates.

So much opinion, smearing, spin and coercion, not to mention the general shouting. It's depressing. I wonder when we might try to create a more civilised system. I wonder if it's possible.

An interesting and scary thread. The polarisation in the US is so, so destructive.

Have any of you read Tara Westover? She was brought up in rural Idaho in a conservative Mormon community and her parents were survivalist weirdos who didn't send her to school. So she homeschooled herself, and through her own efforts and ability got into Brigham Young University and then on to Cambridge for a PhD and Harvard for further study.

She has a lot of interesting things to say about the rural/urban divide and the superior, disdainful attitude of 'educated' Americans living in coastal states to rural Americans. Her memoir is called 'Educated'.

Something she said struck me ; she said she found more open-mindeness in a conservative Mormon university than she did in either Harvard or Cambridge.

This is quite a good interview with her here-
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2019/12/tara-westover-trump-rural-america/600916/

I do 100% disagree with the 'no trans in the military thing'. I don't see the need. Ofte hormones are brought up to explain that, but..hormones would surely come under usual 'rules' about medication that could affect performace surely? It seems the ban is on anyone who is trans, whether medicated or not

There are two issues here. For medication, they do worry about fitness to serve. You won’t be allowed to join if you have diabetes or ADHD, for instance. You can absolutely be medically discharged for developing diabetes while in the military.

The second issue is that, as usual, women will have to step aside to make room for men. Fitness tests and physical tests for special teams — would transwomen only have to pass the female standards? Massive unfair advantage ...

I think no woman has yet passed the Navy Seal test. What if a transwoman made it? Would we have to laud them as the first female Navy Seal?

Horrible

Does the no trans in military also mean that the military don’t have to pick up the medical bills from transitioning? But otherwise is it a good idea to have someone with dysphoria (of any sort) in your fighting unit? Might it be a distraction from their purpose? I don’t know much about where the line is draw for other medical, psychiatric or neurodevelopmental conditions but surely it needs to be considered using the same criteria rather than an ideological yes or no. And transwomen should not be placed in female units or promoted as ‘the first woman to....’ as they are still men. If that is an issue then perhaps they shouldn’t be in the military.

Having said that, I do 100% disagree with the 'no trans in the military thing'. I don't see the need. Ofte hormones are brought up to explain that, but..hormones would surely come under usual 'rules' about medication that could affect performace surely? It seems the ban is on anyone who is trans, whether medicated or not. Unless I misunderstood it, not that up to date on American politics as a lot of the time I don't even slightly understand it.

He revealed again that he doesn't really know anything about the trans debate but implied he will still give campaigners everything they want

Thats terrifying really. I wonder how many with power (I know he doesnt as such yet, but he might) think this way. Oh just do what they ask for, they will be happy and who cares really. I have seen women whinging about this, but women always whinge so its obviously about nthing. And if it is something, I still don't care because it won't affect me.

Should surely be necessary to actually understand a topic, before changing laws and such on it! I doubt Trump knows much about it either really. But..he is Trump. The opposition is supposed to be 'better' than a guy who really, to most of the world is a totally reactionary, attention seeking joke of a man, who got lucky because the woman he ran against was not liked much.

Another US perspective here for what it's worth. I'm in the southwest. I'm voting Libertarian -- not Biden nor Trump.

No one I know is happy with our choices -- not Trump and not Biden. No one is happy with either the Democrat party nor the Republican party.

Most Biden supporters I know are more anti-Trump than pro-Biden. Trump supporters seem to prefer his policies more than the person.

My gender critical friends and family are mostly divided by age. Young women want to vote Biden to protect reproductive rights... Older women won't vote for the guy that will definitely give up all our sex-based rights because Roe v Wade might be challenged. The talk about Biden packing the Supreme Court and locking in so many "woke" justices is also concerning. So some older women will either vote 3rd party or won't vote for president at all.

In the bigger picture, no one is happy about how Covid has been handled, the promised then stalled second stimulus, or the George Floyd violence/riots, the tech giants influence and censorship, or cancel culture in general as it affects more people on more issues.

I think Trump will win, but more because of Biden losing votes than Trump gaining votes. My best guess is that the Democrats have a better chance of taking the Senate than the White House.

That's what I see and hear if it helps.

they weren't peacefully protesting during the day like all the white people who DID live here

Are these your out of towners ? People not like you?

www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2020/08/25/dc-protesters-blm-diner-confrontation/%3foutputType=amp