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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

DD selling her body online

84 replies

Throwaway966846 · 29/09/2020 23:43

Throwaway so it isn't linked to my account.
HELP please
My DD19 has informed me that she has been making adult videos and 'camming' to help pay for uni living. Sad

I feel so let down. I no longer know the strong young woman I raised, I'm sure she's been influenced by uni friends that 'sex work is work' and empowering to do. Angry
I don't know what to do, I don't want to alienate her but I can't stomach the thought of her selling her body online. How can I persuade her to stop? I feel like I've failed as a mother Sad

OP posts:
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MrGHardy · 29/07/2021 16:32

She should at least block users whose IP is from the UK. Some will use VPNs but not all and it will reduce chances of someone who knows her coming across her. Although likely will reduce her income, too.

moofolk · 29/07/2021 13:28

2,500 now!

OP how is your daughter? I remember this thread from last year.

ChattyLion · 26/07/2021 23:15

Now 1500+!!

ChattyLion · 24/07/2021 09:08

1000+ Signatures
Keep sharing!
www.change.org/p/university-of-leicester-revoke-the-university-of-leicester-student-sex-work-policy-and-toolkits

If you’re on social media please copy in The Office for students, the regulatory body for universities and the trade body representing 140 Universities, Universities UK.
The ‘authorities’ in academia and obviously the leadership of individual universities are completely and shockingly failing in their duties on this issue. It is beyond unacceptable to try to normalise and minimise the impacts of the paid sexual abuse of women students. Sex work IS abuse. It damages women. Legitimate, defensible forms of ‘work’ shouldn’t damage you as the ‘worker’ or damage any other person. Trying to reframe abuse as choice and empowering is staggering woman-hating and craven dick pandering. They need to get on with their actual jobs of educating and supporting all students, including the female ones.

Forgotthebins · 23/07/2021 19:15

I wonder if she could at least wear a wig and make up that makes her look less like herself - to reduce the chances of being recognised later? Throwaway, I understand your shock - but this is no reflection on your parenting. You raised a young woman in a time where young women are beset by pressures from money to porn to ever-present social media scrutiny. The great thing is that she told you. I think you can thank her for being open even while at the same time being fairly honest about your reaction (maybe a toned down version of honest). I would need to say it made me worried and sad and she probably knows you well enough that she would be surprised if you said it was all ok.

My first worry would be finding out if she is actually in financial trouble and needs help, or just wants a nicer lifestyle. After that, my main worry would be about how to get out of it into something better. If she went to uni this probably isn’t her dream career, but the time spent on camera (and doing tax returns on the money, as someone said) is time not dedicated to achieving her real goals. Can you talk about cam work on your CV or in interviews? If not, could a less well paid job now that could be a stepping stone, be a better investment in a career she really wants? That would probably be where I would focus my attention in conversations after the basic safety and clearing the air emotionally.

DdraigGoch · 23/07/2021 17:19

@WelliesandWine88

She sounds like a pretty amazing, independent.amd confident young woman to me. What you do is support her and her choices. It's her body to do with as she pleases. She's not hurting anyone. My motto is 'do what you want so long as you're not intentionally, maliciously hurting people'.
That's one of Bernard Woolley's irregular verbs, isn't it? I am independent and confident, you are naive, and she may need to move house to avoid a stalker.
annadjinn · 23/07/2021 17:16

Exactly, VeryLongBeeeeep.

Here is a link to the petition again. I cannot overemphasise how important it is that we get large numbers of signatures. I really do think that's the most likely thing to get Leicester to rethink.

www.change.org/p/university-of-leicester-revoke-the-university-of-leicester-student-sex-work-policy-and-toolkits

VeryLongBeeeep · 23/07/2021 16:33

Which other forms of work are set up entirely for the purpose of bringing a man to orgasm?

In every other workplace I've ever known that would be a) a disciplinary offence and b) a health hazard.

FannyCann · 23/07/2021 16:08

@lurkingdh

"Techie here with a special interest in security.

That's an excellent resource with uniformly sound advice throughout. Everyone should follow their recommendations for everything online, camming or not.

I'd be more than happy to explain/help others who want to start doing so."

I'm glad I passed on a useful resource that passes muster! I had it tucked away, but not being a techie myself had no idea of the quality!
I must take another look and check my own activities. Smile

FannyCann · 23/07/2021 16:06

I was looking for this thread! Thank you so much for posting the petition @annadjinn I have signed and sending to my daughters.
I'll be circulating to other dd friends off to university this autumn too and I'm going to be making sure they are on the look out for signs of infiltration at their university they are going to, displays at freshers week (if they have one) for instance.
Well done Nordic Model Now for sterling work on this toolkit and the petition.

irresistibleoverwhelm · 23/07/2021 15:51

@WelliesandWine88

She sounds like a pretty amazing, independent.amd confident young woman to me. What you do is support her and her choices. It's her body to do with as she pleases. She's not hurting anyone. My motto is 'do what you want so long as you're not intentionally, maliciously hurting people'.
Don’t you think actively contributing to and perpetrating porn, porn culture and all the misogyny and sexist attached to that is hurting people? Like all girls and women for starters? And quite a lot of men?

That’s akin to saying about someone taking up small time drug dealing that it’s okay because no-one’s getting hurt or exploited. If you’re not just participating in but actively colluding and helping perpetrate a damaging capitalist quasi-“industry” with its roots in violence and oppression, you are not “not hurting anyone”. You’re actively collaborating in your own oppression and that of many many other people in a system that is much wider and more violent and coercive than you like to think.

So no, I don’t think that the OP’s daughter is a wonderful young woman for doing cam work; I think she’s a young woman colluding in her own oppression, but I also think she’s choosing to participate in the fringes of a systematic “industry” which revels in and perpetrates violence and oppression to women and girls all over the world. And that this directly harms me, and my small daughter, for example, to start with.

We rightly condemn men who look at child pornography, even if they haven’t actively abused any children themselves. We do this on the grounds that by creating a market for imagery like that, they help perpetrate its creation. Small time porn and sex work does help create a market for porn and the exploitation of women. It isn’t innocent and women who pretend that it is just all good capitalist empowering fun are lying to themselves about the nasty and illegal markets this actively helps create.

There’s a thin legal line between someone else filming and camming an under-18 and a girl 18+ doing it herself; but what difference does it make to the men who just want live porn of teenage women? Do you think they have moral scruples about the imagery they’re watching or the markets for sex work they create or fine distinctions like that?

The “sex work is work” mantra is morally twisted and disingenuous. Not the least because if you pretend that selling porn or sex is just like working at Sports Direct (only better!), then you’d have to conclude that it wasn’t by any means “empowering”. No-one thinks the waitress in your restaurant is “empowered” because she brings the customer what he wants, even if she’s the waitress at The Ivy.

WelliesandWine88 · 23/07/2021 15:34

She sounds like a pretty amazing, independent.amd confident young woman to me.
What you do is support her and her choices. It's her body to do with as she pleases. She's not hurting anyone.
My motto is 'do what you want so long as you're not intentionally, maliciously hurting people'.

dyslek · 23/07/2021 15:33

At least one woman has died while doing 'camwork'
so its not really that safe is it?

DdraigGoch · 23/07/2021 15:25

@walkingthedog1

Do you know what she's doing? These videos have such a broad range it may be less drastic than you think? The poison that's being sold is that cam work is sex work in the same way full contact is sex work. It's not. It creates a false solidarity that's to the advantage of the porn and prostitution industry
Even if cam work is safer than standing on street corners, there remains a very real risk of being stalked or being exposed in years to come with consequences upon your career.
JoodyBlue · 23/07/2021 12:40

Sex work isn't work. Anything that requires you to use your body to benefit others for money is abuse in my opinion. I have brought my son up this way. I would say the same to my daughter. I would never cut a child off. But I would be clear about how I feel and would try to have an honest conversation.

If she is an adult she is old enough to have an adult conversation. I wouldn't baulk at expressing my disappointment either. I would make clear that the love is always there, but that disapproval can also be there.

It is the continuation of the parental boundary. The reason the culture is the mess it is, is parents have stopped parenting

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 23/07/2021 12:37

If her face has ever been visible on screen, she’s setting herself up to be blackmailed, doxxed or possibly stalked or worse. She has no control over the use other people make of her image.

Not your fault, OP. But do remind her that anything put on the internet should be considered permanent, whether you delete it or not.

Keepemguessing · 23/07/2021 12:31

Signed.

BadSeedsComeAndGo · 23/07/2021 11:26

You should look into the tax position. I have no idea how that would operate in these situations but I imagine she should be paying income tax.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 23/07/2021 11:16

Some great comments and hopefully useful support for the OP.

Looking at those guidelines - who'd have thought that university life is now about grooming teenagers into prostitution as a career choice? So many creepy men must be thrilled. Sad

ChattyLion · 23/07/2021 11:13

Bumping thread for that petition.
Hope you and yours are doing OK OP.

irresistibleoverwhelm · 23/07/2021 11:13

I see it didn’t take long before the “sex work is work” brigade popped up Hmm

Minor league drug dealing, petty theft, all sorts of fraud, writing fake exam coursework for profit, exploiting migrant workers for agricultural labour at below minimum wage are all “work” too, so that’s ok then?

You lot really need to actually read some Marx and think a bit harder about work and exploitation.

I could make a mint online (quite legally) helping people cheat their professional and degree examiners - I don’t; because it’s immoral and wrong on many levels, and I have both self-respect and a fully functioning moral compass.

OP I’m sorry Flowers - hopefully she will find it’s not so great after all and drop it. She must feel ambivalent or odd about it or she wouldn’t have told you, and your opinion must matter to her. There are some times when expressing great parental disappointment is not a bad thing. She may well be looking for some clear boundaries from you to help her stop doing it.

SiobhanSharpe · 23/07/2021 10:54

Signed too.

Mulletsaremisunderstood · 23/07/2021 10:51

Signed

dyslek · 23/07/2021 10:49

I think there is a huge campaign which targets very young women entering university for recruitment in to the sex industry, espicially online 'work'.
I wonder how haveing a generation of women proffessionals who have this material online will play out in society?
There will be a whole cohort of people possibly in influencial postions who can be blackmailed.

walkingthedog1 · 23/07/2021 10:36

Do you know what she's doing? These videos have such a broad range it may be less drastic than you think?
The poison that's being sold is that cam work is sex work in the same way full contact is sex work. It's not. It creates a false solidarity that's to the advantage of the porn and prostitution industry