Lib Dem’s definition of transphobia

It's interesting that most of us pulled the same section out,

Current examples include referring to a trans woman or non-binary person as a “biological man” or a trans man or non-binary person as a “biological woman”, which eradicates the trans person’s gender identity in favour of their biology at birth.

They are putting someone's feelings directly above facts.

The other bit I thought was self-contradictory was:

Knowingly promoting the idea that gender dysphoria is a form of, or is caused by, mental illness, which directly contradicts NHS guidance

How can believing yourself to actually be of the opposite sex despite the physical evidence of your body not be some kind of mental disorder? And I can't think of anything else which is not a disorder of some kind that requires surgery and hormone treatment.

This also makes safe medical treatment for people who identify as trans impossible.

How will you avoid harm to people who identify as trans and who in some circumstances need screening for sex-specific conditions if you cannot refer to that necessity? You can only avoid referring to them separately by targeting screening campaigns directly at them. And how will you identify the right audience for such targeted health campaigns?

What tork said.

How are trans people going to fight for what they want if they are not allowed to describe themselves as trans as that puts them in a separate group.

They've shot themselves in the foot there haven't they.

There are LD members on twitter saying the wider membership wasn’t consulted

It still has one? Maybe they forgot.

That wording means describing a transwoman as being a transwoman would be transphobic because the transwoman is being put into a separate category of person from women

They would then have to he reported as men amd women when they are victims of crimes or medical.mal.practice etc wouldnt that in fact render all the statistics tbey constantly bang on about transphobic and how will they get their points across?

That wording means describing a transwoman as being a transwoman would be transphobic because the transwoman is being put into a separate category of person from women.

Using phrases or language to describe trans people which are designed to suggest that trans people are a separate category of person from the gender they identify as or that their gender identity is not valid. Current examples include referring to a trans woman or non-binary person as a “biological man” or a trans man or non-binary person as a “biological woman”, which eradicates the trans person’s gender identity in favour of their biology at birth.

Congratulations, LibDems, you've just declared both the Gender Recognition Act and the Equality Act to be transphobic.

Because protecting people who identify as trans on the basis of gender reassignment through both laws actually requires doing just that.

Could be a useful starting point for those that have a Lib Dem MP though... (if they still exist). Do they agree with their party's definition of transphobia?

They haven't thought this through have they?

Well, this is what they say:

"It has taken us some months and many different drafts"

I don't know how many months 'some' is. It's a shame we weren't one of the interested parties consulted in this. We have way more than 'some' months of discussion about these issues.

Or in a situation that might cause a woman extreme harm or death.

Now we have to debate women's rights without being able to say that Karen White is a biological man or the cyclist is a biological man or the pregnant man is biological woman. FFS.

Current examples include referring to a trans woman or non-binary person as a “biological man” or a trans man or non-binary person as a “biological woman”, which eradicates the trans person’s gender identity in favour of their biology at birth.

Effectively making it impossible to refer to the sex of a non-binary person in a situation where that might cause extreme harm or death.

They haven't thought this through have they?

I think this bit is scariest

Advocating the withdrawal or defunding of access to transition-related medical treatment for trans people or advocating or facilitating any kind of therapy that tries to change a person’s gender identity.

Does this mean the LibDems consider it transphobic to campaign against children being given puberty blockers?

Does this mean the LibDems consider it transphobic to suggest to a girl that her feelings are maybe as a result of being is lesbian not trans? Autistic not trans?

First, I'd like to point out that they have used the Stonewall definition of trans, which includes those of us who feel that our gender does not sit comfortably with our sex. They missed out the definition of gender but I feel safe assuming that they would use Stonewall's definition here as well so I'll c&p it.

"Often expressed in terms of masculinity and femininity, gender is largely culturally determined and is assumed from the sex assigned at birth."

Yes, I definitely feel that my 'largely culturally determined' gender does not sit comfortably with my sex. I disagree with parts of that definition but for argument's sake I'll go with it.

Although the Stonewall definition of gender identity forgoes the use of masculine and feminine entirely, making that definition even more confusing:

"A person’s innate sense of their own gender, whether male, female or something else (see non-binary below), which may or may not correspond to the sex assigned at birth."

Are they talking about gender or sex here? They state in their definition of sex that the terms are interchanged. Which is a little odd, because I've always thought that the concept of sex and gender being different and not interchangeable is one of the areas of common ground between GC feminists and TRAs.

So any attempts to misrepresent us is classed as transphobia by the Lib Dems (according to this independent website, at least).

Any attempt to refer to trans people's biological sex is transphobia, but that is exactly the distinction we need to have to maintain women's rights.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems that by stating in this document that referring to a transwoman as a biological man is transphobic, they've basically admitted that there is a conflict here, despite us being told otherwise.

NOBODY is assigned male or female at birth.
Their chromosomes are fixed in every cell at conception.

How does the TWAW so want access to all women's spaces
work in mosques and synagogues and temples?

Maybe something starting with fasc... would be more appropriate?

Maybe now is the time to drop the word ‘liberal’ from their name.

Its also transphobic when not being transphobic and ignoring bioogical sex leads to illness injury or death .

So healthcare is transphobic because for trans people its shit butnits shit because in order to treat properly you have to ve transphobic and treat according to sex.

No one quite knows what they want here...

So it is transphobia for a paramedic to pass on the useful bit of info "This is Steve, he's a biological woman" when Steve is rushed into hospital? (Possibly with something like an ectopic pregnancy.) of course if I introduced Steve at work in a meeting saying the same thing it would be entirely unnecessary, but there's a time and a place for everything.

Similar to some school's advice I read.

Which was you must report all incidents of transphobic bullying, and if you report that you haven't had any, that in itself is transphobic because it means it's being swept under the carpet.

This is the problem when you allow TRAs to write your copy. They assume that the rest of the world already agrees to A, B & C, and you just have to convince them of D.

Nope.

Requiring trans people to be separate from society, using segregated facilities, or denying them access to facilities which would be required in order for them to fully participate in public life.

Yes, because no one at the party seems to give a fuck about women's facilities and why they're there.

You cant access services that don't exist due to a lack of valid information about your household...

Love this -
“ This includes spreading the idea of a “trans conspiracy” which asserts undue influence over media or government or claiming that cisgender allies support trans rights initiatives out of fear or bribery rather than a genuine belief that trans rights are human rights.”
Coming from the Libdems via Stonewall. Ie a trans organisation exerting influence in a political party.