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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Ann Sinnott is asking for clarity on guidance for the Equality Act

443 replies

MilleniumHallsWalledGarden · 26/08/2020 15:36

around the guidance for the Equality Act 2010, and is crowdfunding for a judicial review. Thought I ought to spread the word.

[title edited by MNHQ at OP's request]

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ThinEndoftheWedge · 01/09/2020 19:56

Trans women are women. Nothing is going to take that away from us.

Nothing will take it away from you except biology, reality, role in human procreation, the fact everyone knows this, inc advocates of TWAW

EmpressJKRowlingSpartacus · 01/09/2020 19:49

So either you don't have a clue what gender dysphoria is, or you are utterly indifferent to the suffering that being forced to live in the wrong gender causes your fellow human beings.

I don’t mind how people express their gender (if they have one) but it shouldn’t make any difference to what facilities they use.

Given the sheer number of genders there are supposed to be nowadays, it’s highly unlikely that all the people using a single-sex space are going to have the same one anyway, so it seems far more sensible to have a gender neutral toilet for each sex.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/09/2020 19:49

We've heard it all before. This isn't about people being trans, it's entirely about their sex, and only their sex. And respect for the rights of women and girls to some sex based spaces and services.

MiladyRenata · 01/09/2020 19:44

Trans women are women. Nothing is going to take that away from us.

MilleniumHallsWalledGarden · 01/09/2020 19:41

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Males making women uncomfortable and violating their privacy and dignity because they want to present as their "authentic selves" should not be the problem of women and girls. Women's feelings matter too.

Agree. Leave women out of it.

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Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/09/2020 19:38

Males making women uncomfortable and violating their privacy and dignity because they want to present as their "authentic selves" should not be the problem of women and girls. Women's feelings matter too.

MiladyRenata · 01/09/2020 19:32

@howard97A

MiladyRenata: Just out of interest, what DO you expect trans women to do when they need a pee and the only loos available are single sex?

Perhaps men should consider this problem before they decide to transition?

Because gender dysphoria makes someone's life a misery until they find the courage to live in their true gender. People with attitudes like yours make it harder for people to find the courage to live as their authentic selves.

So either you don't have a clue what gender dysphoria is, or you are utterly indifferent to the suffering that being forced to live in the wrong gender causes your fellow human beings.

MilleniumHallsWalledGarden · 01/09/2020 19:29

@EmpressJKRowlingSpartacus

I’m not saying that this is a ‘women's problem to solve’.

I think the most constructive thing trans allies like Owen Jones & Dr Harrop could be doing is campaigning for men's loos to be made safer and more inclusive for ALL the male sex, however they identify.

Yes, I absolutely agree with this. This is not women's problem. This is a male problem, and they need to provide the solution.

OP posts:
EmpressJKRowlingSpartacus · 01/09/2020 19:22

I’m not saying that this is a ‘women's problem to solve’.

I think the most constructive thing trans allies like Owen Jones & Dr Harrop could be doing is campaigning for men's loos to be made safer and more inclusive for ALL the male sex, however they identify.

Signalbox · 01/09/2020 16:31

Bumping again. Just donated. Good luck Ann!

teawamutu · 01/09/2020 15:26

No misunderstanding - just me failing to make it clear enough that I entirely agree with you! Sorry. Blush

howard97A · 01/09/2020 15:12

Tea, is there some misunderstanding here?

MiladyRenata is asking ‘What DO you expect trans women to do when they need a pee and the only loos available are single-sex?’

My suggestion is that this a problem for men to consider before they decide to transition.

I’m not saying that this is a ‘women's problem to solve’.

teawamutu · 01/09/2020 12:01

@howard97A

MiladyRenata: Just out of interest, what DO you expect trans women to do when they need a pee and the only loos available are single sex?

Perhaps men should consider this problem before they decide to transition?

Why is this women's problem to solve?
howard97A · 01/09/2020 11:45

MiladyRenata: Just out of interest, what DO you expect trans women to do when they need a pee and the only loos available are single sex?

Perhaps men should consider this problem before they decide to transition?

Siablue · 01/09/2020 11:20

@MiladyRenata

Just out of interest, what DO you expect trans women to do when they need a pee and the only loos available are single sex?
By law there always has to be a disabled toilet (which is why if a premises only has one toilet it is a disabled toilet). So this is a straw man argument as disabled toilets are always single sex. This is not a problem as it is a self contained cubicle.

If there is not a disabled toilet then they are breaking the law and you can join disabled people in solidarity in campaigning for adequate toilet provision.

If you think it is important for people to have an apporiate toilet for their gender identity (as opposed to sex) where should non-binary and all the other gendered people go to the loo?

crunchermuncher · 01/09/2020 10:51

Argh - intended not Inverness! Need to stop posting on this bloody phone...

crunchermuncher · 01/09/2020 10:50

Bump - this is so important to have laws made by Parliament upheld as they were Inverness to be interpreted, not as some lobby group wants them to be.
I Will dig again if I can.

highame · 01/09/2020 08:09

A bit of a bump.

Joisanofthedales · 31/08/2020 16:21

Just had a bite at the elephant. Will bite again if I can.
This is so important for our children and grandchildren but especially the girls and women. I have so much love and respect to those who take on the trans juggernaut in what ever form that defiance takes.
I feel very emotional about this.

Sexnotgender · 30/08/2020 21:31

Done a little digging. This is so important.

Mollscroll · 30/08/2020 21:22

What a great message. I will dig again. I have resources and this is how I will deploy them.

I no longer give to lots of the charities I used to support because they’re lost to this nonsense agenda and their actual purpose is now secondary to creating a self-perpetuating career path for a cabal of middle class wokesters. Instead my charity money is going towards crowdfunders like this.

Thank you Ann.

DialSquare · 30/08/2020 21:01

I received this email too. She really appreciates the support doesn't she. I've dug already but will do so again this month if needed. I try to donate to all the cases once a month if I can,

MilleniumHallsWalledGarden · 30/08/2020 20:58

Yes it made me well up too. I'm so grateful she is willing to undertake this for all our sakes.

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Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 30/08/2020 20:38

Exactly like an elephant but you don’t have to start with the toes Grin

Fabulous update letter isn’t it- her message to those who made small donations they could ill afford made me a bit tearful when I read it Blush

MilleniumHallsWalledGarden · 30/08/2020 20:28

Email from Ann Sinnott^
^
^Update on Official sources provide unlawful guidance on the 2010 Equality Act!

Many thanks to all of you for making this happen and getting us over the line to our initial target!

I am so grateful to each and every one of you and your comments have humbled and heartened in equal measure.

Now we’re into stretch target territory, so I’m taking this opportunity to sketch out why this case is important and why I’m hoping that those who can will donate again.

Before I continue, a word to those who made small donations that you could ill-afford. One mother of a 5yr old brought me to tears. She said she doesn’t have much but gave what she could afford because “my daughter needs to live in a society that protects her rights”. This mother really understands the fundamental importance of this case. To her, and to those of you in similar situations, I say, “Thank you from the very bottom of my heart” and beg you not to donate again – there are others who will bear the weight that you cannot carry, because your daughters and your sons also matter to us.

This case isn’t about an individual woman who has undergone harassment and discrimination with whom we can identify and sympathise, who tugs our heart strings and opens our purses. This case is dry and technical. It’s about rectifying unlawful application and wrongful interpretation of the law. It appeals to our sense of justice, our intellect rather than our capacity for empathy. But, in reality, this case has many human faces. Unlawful guidance by those, once trusted, official sources enabled the dreadful situations in which women find themselves. Longstanding unlawful guidance - from the very entities that are responsible for overseeing equalities in the UK - both enabled and effectively justified harassment and discrimination.

Every female academic silenced and threatened with loss of tenure, every woman harassed in her workplace or sacked from her job, every author silenced or dropped by her publisher, every woman cheated of the trophy or award that was rightfully hers, every domestic violence refuge coercively threatened with loss of funding and forced into being ‘inclusive’, every woman insulted on social media for merely stating a belief in biological reality, every fear-filled woman silencing herself – all of these facilitated by unlawful guidance. Organisations instating ‘gender neutral’ toilets and changing rooms, schools doing the same despite rocketing rates of sexual assaults and rapes in schools (even at primary levels) and in our hospitals, psychiatric and medical, single-sex wards being changed to mixed-sex to the deep dismay of patients, men as well as women - all facilitated by unlawful guidance. Each and every one of the legal actions for which we have gladly dipped into our purses to support, was made necessary because of a misinterpretation and misapplication of the law, and each and every one of those cases was engineered by unlawful guidance. Unlawful guidance lies at the root of it all and that’s why this vital case is of fundamental importance.

I’ve lived with this for almost a year but I’m still astonished. I can still scarcely believe that this has happened. And I am so angry.

Before I go, let me tell you a little about AEA.

AEA is a Community Interest Company whose founding mission is to promote and further the interests of women and girls. Providing training on EA2010 and the single-sex exception is an important first project because EA2010 is potentially a good law for females, provided it is properly applied.

AEA became fully operational in Oct 2019 and quickly obtained a major national retailer as a client. Along with all other organisations we were stymied by Covid. Income to date has been minimal, but so are outgoings. We cut our cloth according to our means so, although we have little capital, we have no debts. We were lucky enough to receive a small government bounce-back loan and that is helping to keep us going for now. If energies had not been redirected into dealing with EHRC and GEO’s unlawful guidance - and finally, as a last resort, this legal action - AEA’s online training would be up and running by now – but it will be soon!

As you can see, AEA is not some lavish foundation needlessly begging for your cash! AEA is, effectively, a new start-up asking for your financial support for this crucial legal action. An action which aims to ensure that a law, which was in part designed to protect females, is correctly interpreted and properly applied.

Thank you again for your support so far. It’s unlikely that EHRC and GEO will capitulate, so this action is likely to go the distance – and that will take a good deal more money. If you can, please continue to support with cash and by publicising and, if possible, encourage family and friends to do the same. And if you happen to have a contact or two with deep pockets, please steer them our way!

I will continue to keep you updated.

Ann Sinnott
Director, AEA^

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