Trying to understand the hate trans people get on here.

I don’t know the difference between a sick and a wash basin but I do know the difference between a buffalo and a bison

I might occasionally use 'wash basin' but it feels a bit posh, actually. Not sure why.

Interesting. So sink has now also become the word for a hand-washing basin as found in a bathroom or lavatory, in England. There used to be a distinction.

I'd clarify kitchen sink or bathroom sink, but I would mostly use sink, yes, and I'm as English as the Mendip hills.

Incidentally, I tend to assume that if someone calls a place to wash your hands a basin they are English, if they call it a sink they are American. To me the sink is where I wash vegetables and the dishes and sometimes my wellies, not a place to wash my hands after I have a pee. Is this wrong? Has "sink" now become a wash-basin in England too?

imhereforthesanity

Yup, the stats thing too. Suddenly there will be millions more women stalkers and gvmt departments will scratch their heads and wonder why women have suddenly changed en mass.
Currently quiet on the stalker front. Not sure if I should worry more because hes plotting or just be relieved for now.

@Gurufloof and worst of all, his crime would go down as being carried out as a women, so against our stats!

I never quite understand why d00dz post negative reviews of Feminism and Mumsnet on FWR.
If I had that much to say about something I hope I would have the common sense to post it where it might be read by people interested in my pov. It must be "a guy thing". That is what my kids used to say when they did something absurd or irrational. It's a guy thing.

For me, it's not "hate for trans" (although I've come acoss a couple of nasty ones - mental health issues at bottom I think, but you know, male/female/purple spotted martian - some people are just nasty ...)

Anyway.

What I object to - and will always object to - is the current trans ideology, and its attempt to redefine what it means fundamentally to be female.

Men have tried to do that for al of recorded history (eg Eve made from Adam's rib etc etc). And it MUST STOP

"Nothing about us without us" as WPUK say. Stop the misogynist erasure of women.

I don't really understand this because to be honest when I'm sat in the cubicle doing my business, I don't think about the persons genitals next to me, it's all very private as you know. The only thing we'd share is the sinks and I don't see a problem with that really

Oddly, this only seems to apply in the womens.

Noone in the womens should care who is next to them, it doesn't matter. If this is the case, then why do some males feel the need to be in the womens in the first place? As surely it doesn't matter who else is there as they are just peeing?

Seems to be the same for fear of male violence too actually.

Its bigoted for women to fear male violence. But its ook for others to go in the womens as THEy fvear male violence.

Odd how it always seems to be women who shouldn't care about their own safety or anything, but its fine for others to worry.

What I do NOT want is a man in the Ladies whom I cannot simply get rid of as a sex-pest, because if I say "Oy, you! Out!" he can claim I am committing a hate-crime against someone who identifies as a woman really, hairy balls, spy camera, leer and all. Until recently, if a woman
started to shout for help in the Ladies and it was discovered that an obviously male person was in there molesting her, he would be ejected. Now, if this lot have their way, she is as likely to be arrested for hate crime as he is to be arrested for indecent exposure, and of the two of them she is the one whose life is more likely to be ruined, her job lost, and all the rest of the palaver which goes with offending one of the lord-and-masters in women's clothing

This is currently a thing I'm spending a lot of time worrying about. I have a stalker, it's a fairly recent addition to my life. I don't want to go into many details so I'll be sparing. Hes young, hes of a religious bent, hes not currently scaring me, but I can already see it escalating and soon he will probably terrify me. Now as we all know calling the police on him wont work, because nothing has happened. Yet. But as we also know it could kick off anytime. I need to be able to run to the loos to escape and phone someone for help. In the current year I dont think that's a possibility. He will simply follow me in and claim woman.
So I'm spending lots of time in my head seeing different scenarios and how to get out of them, or better still always be outside when stalker is around. But being outside is not always possible.
If only misogyny and stalking before it gets to the terrifying stage was illegal.

@Winniefred thank you - you spoke for us and your post should be immortalized. Thank you!!!

BaronEssoStation: I assumed you had some glitter shits pre-rolled and ready to give to worthy causes

You say that with the same sincerity that the OP is “trying to understand the hate trans people get on here.”

Isn't the answer to the OP that what is found distasteful (not as a rule actually hated) by a large majority of women is not transwomen (most of whom are not offensive gits), but the offensive gits who have glommed onto trans women as a new way to legitimise their need to belittle and reduce women, whether for sexual gratification or some sort of power play or whatever other twisted reason they may have....

What are hated, and I think with reason, are these fellow travellers who want the undisputed right to go into the ladies not because they need a pee but because they want to ask strangers about tampons, wash their willies in the hand-basins, enjoy their power to upset women and make that safe space unsafe for women.

I don't give a tuppeny one if a transwoman comes into the public toilet where I am, goes into a cubicle and uses it to urinate or defecate, gets dressed again in the cubicle, washes her hands and leaves -- behaves, in fact, as a woman generally would. Chances are I won't notice that she is there, or that she has male genitalia if she does have them. Good luck to her: she has a difficult life to lead and doesn't need any extra agro.

What I do NOT want is a man in the Ladies whom I cannot simply get rid of as a sex-pest, because if I say "Oy, you! Out!" he can claim I am committing a hate-crime against someone who identifies as a woman really, hairy balls, spy camera, leer and all. Until recently, if a woman started to shout for help in the Ladies and it was discovered that an obviously male person was in there molesting her, he would be ejected. Now, if this lot have their way, she is as likely to be arrested for hate crime as he is to be arrested for indecent exposure, and of the two of them she is the one whose life is more likely to be ruined, her job lost, and all the rest of the palaver which goes with offending one of the lord-and-masters in women's clothing.

Great posts Winnie and your post about the events in the women’s loo .

I have quite often had to wash blood out of skirts and dresses. Or red wine out of shirts. Sharing loos / hand wash areas would mean on flooding days ( and I have plenty of those) I would be even more housebound. But that’s ok for some people obviously, because as long as a male’s need, no matter how they present, is recognised everything is rosy in their world.

And I know a number of friends who have miscarried in public loos. It is not a rarity.

I do find it rather telling that someone posts a rebuttal about not letting a ‘male’ medic into the loo. Way to spectacularly try to shut down very valid reasons for single sex spaces to remain.

@PinkyU The difference is that the responding male Medic in each case was there because the female in question CONSENTED through raising a 999 call! That the service providers, The NHS, did everything in their power to succeed in sending a female Medic as the first contact responder in each case, going to the effort to try to make undignified situations more dignified for the females concerned is a position I fully indorse. That this upsets your sensibilities is of no concern of mine but I stand with the NHS in trying against all the odds to meet sex based dignity in the process of delivering their medical service as and when they can. 👍

Very moving post, Winniefred. Thank you for posting it.

Not The strawman of what sex the person should be in a medical emergency.

Pinky

I believe, statistically, most miscarriages happen on the toilet.

The point is, having a loo filled with men would make a tragic situation worse.

Likewise washing menstrual blood from your hands or hand drying a blouse that is wet from leaking breasts.

Not to mention the horrifying thought that there are a number of men who find these female biological functions arousing.

When this issue was on Twitter, there were a number of men demanding access to women's toilets who couldn't see that having a miscarriage was any different from defecating.

That's the level of empathy we are talking about.

You honestly, genuinely cannot understand why a male paramedic entering the women's toilets in an emergency situation is different from a scenario where men and women use the same toilets on an everyday basis?

Do you apply this logic in other situations? For instance, can you understand why a married, monogamous woman may consent to an internal examination by a male doctor and that this would not be a case of cheating on her husband?

Noone on this board is suggesting that a male paramedic should not help a women in an emergency. What a straw man argument.

Excellent posts winniefred

And excellent posts, winnie

@Winniefred excellent first post, that should be saved on MN somehow

for your second