Ghislaine Maxwell

What would make sense is for them to be rivals in public but protective of each other's interests in private. Which is probably what's happening.

When you say 'tow a better line', do you mean behave more civilly?

Please stop saying she was 'groomed' by her father. She participated in most of the abuse. She is a paedophile and abused out of choice. There doesn't have to be a reason, she did it because she wanted to. She also liked the social climbing and was greedy for money and power. I've heard lots of stories about her cruelty to animals too. There was a party where she was throwing her little puppy against a wall and laughing. No one called her out on it. Evil bitch

That’s the part I couldn’t get. If Trump was embroiled as much as Clinton was, why the hatred towards Hilary (obviously misogyny aside because he hates all women, especially those with power). Surely you’d expect him to tow a better line if she had sensitive information on him regarding Epstein.

Not entirely the case - and Gatsby is fiction.

Andrew's mistake was to think of himself as rich and powerful but he is nothing in comparison with Clinton or Elon Musk. There are degrees of rich and powerful. He's been set up as the fall guy. Ghislaine Maxwell has too but she'll worm her way out of it. As far as the FBI is concerned the girls are a side issue. My guess is that they want Epstein's financial clients and the additional services he offered might be a way in.

She might meet with "an accident" same as him. Whatever they've got on tape about all these rich people is not anything they want to come out.

Just read "The Great Gatsby" about how rich people behave. They know they can do anything they like to everyone and anyone. Just because they can.

can't imagine what GM has been offered. Maybe a choice of execution method?
Guards who notice and react when someone tries to strangle her?

Someone very powerful doesn’t want this to come out and will spend money on it.

I'd say many someones. And I think Camilla Long in The Times is right to suggest her arrest was negotiated, hence the lack of TV footage.

I'm not expecting anyone really to be held to account. I suspect Trump will be diagnosed with dementia after losing the election and Clinton will be manipulated into doing useful things.

The FBI will take notes and lock them away until they need them.

I can't imagine what GM has been offered. Maybe a choice of execution method?

Epstein's fabulous wealth probably came from money laundering.

He was supposed to be a financial advisor but he didn't have an account with a single Wall Street financial house. There is no trace of what he did, or for whom.

He got that by blackmailing the rich and famous whom he provided 'abuse services' for, and then recorded.

I think this is a key point. As well as allegations of abuse, there is evidence of organised crime. She can argue all she wants about consent, but it seems likely that there is an evidence trail that links the people in the tapes to financial transactions that benefited Epstein and Maxwell.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/04/high-society-to-hideaway-arrest-ghislaine-maxwells-dramatic-fall

"The Southern District of New York ran the investigation into Epstein through its Public Corruption Unit, as it had with its case against Epstein. The charges against Maxwell, involving three alleged but unnamed victims, overlap with the charges brought against the former financier, who killed himself while in custody days after being formally charged.

Both are signals, overt and covert, that neither case was ever truly about Epstein or Maxwell’s alleged sexual misconduct. The Southern District is primarily the federal government’s prosecuting arm for Wall Street securities fraud, organised crime and political corruption; prosecutors do not make their careers busting sex crimes, whatever the level of moral public outrage."

I think measures to ensure the law applies to everyone, regardless of wealth and influence, would do a lot more to prevent similar cases than cod analysis of Ghislaine Maxwell's inner psyche.

And if Maxwell seriously has a PR team, here's a free tip: Even now, she could still do the right thing and co-operate with the prosecution. It's not too late. You're welcome.

I worked for RM. It was a very junior position and it was very brief but it was enough to see that he was a frightening man and that most of his staff were frightened of him. The atmosphere was really horrible.

RM glorified in being a crook and that people were too scared to challenge him. JE was the same - it was all about power / security.
He got that by blackmailing the rich and famous whom he provided 'abuse services' for, and then recorded.

GM was in thrall to that, like she had been with Daddy.
She was afraid of having no money / power - Daddy died re this.

Then there were the very odd family dynamics she grew up in.
RM liked to pit his children against each other and against him.
GM was 'Daddy's little girl' in a very unhealthy way - undone by death.
She may have 'loved' JE / had a sexual response to him.
She may have procured and directly abused just because of that, or she may have had a latent / developed a streak of sadism over time.

I think abuse is about power and cruelty expressed via sex and RM was all about power in the world and cruelty with his children.
So, it was 'in her DNA' and in her twisted growing up environment.

Does this 'excuse her' - NO.
It doesn't help to 'monster' others, it is more useful to understand why, in the hope of preventing further occurrences.

I too have small hopes the victims will ever receive much justice.
There are too many powerful people involved. Society is corrupt.
But I hope she sings like a canary soon because I fear she may 'have an accident' like JE did. As much truth as possible should come out.

It has all been sewn up in advance. The powerful have been protected and Andrew is the fall guy.

Remember what happened to the woman who was set to testify on this sort of thing last time? Found hanging in the garage.

I think once you dissociate and nothing really matters there are no limits to the depravity. Particularly for people who live in a bubble of wealth and power.

She is part of the elite, untouchable. Fuck all will become of this. Is she really arrested? Literally they can say that she killed herself and fuck all will happen.

It will be Epstein 2.0, be a meme for a bit then be forgotten.

Did anyone see the spacey videos on YouTube? I mean seriously wtf was that all about. That seemed absolutely mental to me, nobody cared.

Why on earth did she decide to stay in the US?

According to the Fail, she has £16M in the bank, British, French and US passports. Supposedly her lawyers advised her to stay in the US and will argue that she had a chance to leave but did not. That will go in her favour with respect to getting bail.

🤷‍♀️ Who knows?

Who will she rat on for that then

I doubt she’ll need to rat anyone.
The trial will cost loads and take up shit loads of police and court time, so there is an incentive for the prosecution to bargain there.
They’ll get her to plead guilty to a slightly lesser charge and tuck her away in the remotest federal prison possible.

She’ll accept that rather than risk the ire of a 100 powerful men much like her father.

I don’t believe she will rat anyone out. If she does the house of cards come down and those protecting her cut off financial and legal support. Those poor women will never see justice.

Who will she rat on for that then?

I have a feeling we could end up disappointed as it all gets wrapped up with her and Epstein being the main charges.

I think they may go after some of the women that were recruited by the pair to then recruit other girls for them.

We might also get one or two people of minor note - e.g an ex senator, some rich business guy that doesn't have much name recognition etc...

I will be genuinely shocked if really big and influential players end up taken down. It so rarely seems to work that way.

I also agree that she was poor in comparison to her previous life. She had a mews property which is nothing to what she had when her father was embezzling. She wanted the lifestyle and she did what she did to keep it.

@RedToothBrush
She's had a year to get her deals set up.

It looks like Andrew is the fall guy. A minor royal nobody likes versus a household name politician? No contest.

v v v interesting

Who is going to be the fall guy?

Or is she the one who does the time to cover for everyone else?