Irish Minister for children appears to be mates with Peter Tatchell

Well marriage is reversible. This is all such a load of bollocks.

Have to be 18 (heterosexual or same sex marriage) to get married in Ireland with min 3 months notice.

Age of sexual consent is 17.

Interestingly, this tattoo business states " Surprisingly, in Ireland, there is no minimum legal age for getting a tattoo. However, giving someone under the age of consent (17 years old) a body modification without parental consent is considered an act of sexual aggression – (as you have skin contact) ".

Age of medical consent is 16; and it's a grey area between 16-18 if you refuse medical intervention.

Dunno what age you can get married in Ireland either. Fucking hell.

Jesus. Funny how alcohol and voting isn't allowed till 18. Are tattoos legal before 18? You can't vote but you're mature enough to make life altering decisions that might sterilise you, remove healthy body parts, commit you to taking hormones for the rest of your life etc.

PT was interviewed on Irish radio last night and said children are not the property of their parents. No shit sherlock - We don't view them as property.

What is the obsession with trying to separate children from their parents? I am starting to despair at how this thinking is taking hold.

I wonder how the government/MSM will spin this one? What - ism will be thrown at parents who mention it?

found the reference, it appears many of the contributors to the book Betrayal Of Youth were subsequently convicted.

ianpace.wordpress.com/2014/07/05/betrayal-of-youth-1986-including-the-contributions-of-middleton-owens-faust-tatchell/

What is disingenuous is O Gorman's and others reference solely to the infamous edited guardian letter, and yet Tatchell has been vocal in this area since the 70s up to present. As others in this thread have said, he has associations with the Paedophile Information Exchange, having written Colin Dunns obituary. I cant find where I read it but several of the coauthors of the book BOY had subsequently been charged with paedophilia and possession of images. Tatchell is a smart man, attempting to place an academic veneer around the discussion of paedophilia and plays with semantics. O Gorman was either arrogant or incredibly naïve in his adulation.

Reading the articles above, there are already concerns being raised by consultants about the now adults that received treatment at ages 16 to 18. Clearly the cracks are already emerging which will hopefully be a wake up call.
You would have to wonder why the HSE would not suspend this policy considering the concerns raised by medical experts. The fact that the minutes of the meeting were changed appears sinister.
I would agree that the Greens will have a hard time pushing through a lot of environmental policy. I also live in a rural area and cannot think of anyone I know that would agree with the extreme trans ideology that is emerging. However the Greens were not in power when the GRA was passed in 2015 and when it was made easier for 16 to 18 years old teens to transition. So clearly they are not the only party that believes in this ideology.

Chesterton's Fence, sorry! Not wall.

I don't believe in witch hunting people.

I do think that Peter Tatchell's foray into really awful ideas in the 70s, should teach us a lesson about why safeguarding, full and free discussion, and caution are absolutely essential when any kind of radical social change is being discussed, ESPECIALLY stuff that involves children in any way.

The whole "Chesterton's Wall" idea.

That has ramifications for the whole trans thing.

Well Eamonn can swivel because here in the West we absolutely do see the urban rural divide.

I bet in Darndale they see the class divide.
On halting sites they see the traveller/settled divide.

I bloody hate the way idpol is playing out right now, but that's not to say different groups of people dont have different concerns and viewpoints.

A generous reading of his comments might say that he is trying to avoid all that division stuff in favour of a properly inclusive narrative, where we are all United in the face of a greater threat.

(Maybe if aliens landed and pointed their ray guns at the ice caps all of humanity would pull together as one. It will probably take something like that .

.....But 2020 isnt over yet)

Rural Ireland is - largely - happy with the way things are, insert disclaimers here, of course. But it's fairly cohesive and (small c) conservative - because in their view theres a lot of good stuff to conserve.
The Greens want to shake things up and make us all swallow some bitter medicine.

Ok, most people will take a couple of spoons.

But they better not waste their chances on a policy that:
-most people think is anti-science. Everyone knows the difference between Male and female anyway, but imagine a farmer who doesnt know how lambs are born!

• keeps parents out of the loop when their kids are going through some sort of crisis. Cant be done in rural Ireland anyway. Too many connections. It will only ruin the trust with schools and parents.

• doesnt allow for that awkward age where teens change and develop so much that they kill you out of embarrassment when you reference that band or look or lad they were mad for 6 months ago.

I really think the Greens have to consider carefully what their remit is.

I know we need green policies but I wish it was someone other than the Greens that were delivering them. Was just reading this piece about their election for party leader and Ryan seems just as out of touch as he did when he was talking about growing salad on window sills to combat food insecurity

"Ryan said he is as “Dub as Dub can be”, and he doesn’t believe in a rural and urban divide.
Ryan promised to get out of Dublin before the end of July, to travel to Cork to see how the government can deliver the proposed Bus Connects project there. " www.thejournal.ie/green-party-hustings-5144058-Jul2020/

So do I.
I'm a rural dweller. The Greens are so needed but so out of touch with anywhere outside of bloody Rathgar. But all city dwellers have to do is sort their rubbish and hop on the Luas. Country people have no Luas. We dont even have a brown bin collection. That wont save us - getting the farmers on board has some chance of making a difference.

And yes. I've just started a new ps job. We are all subtlety dancing around each other because we HAVE to be ultra careful. But I've had one or two conversations with women aged 31 to 55. We are sympathetic to the struggles trans people face but cant accept transing kids. One particular hot button item was elderly ladies in care homes needing personal care. One woman has a teen daughter whose friend socially transitioned but desisted in college. Not impressed with the notion of rushing confused teens on rather than giving them the chance to get to know themselves a bit more. But she said,in fairness the school was very good with a Take Things Slow attitude, to the kid herself, the parents and the classmates. So that is a good news story.

Theres a mid 20's gay lad at work too. Haven't had a direct convo with him but he seems to give histrionics of all sorts the big roll eye and does know the difference between men and women, as do his mates by the way he talks.

It's like Stella O'Malley said in that interview- they are just looking for woke points.

Brilliant points classicspring and 7days
They will have no credibility throughout the country. I feel so let down by them myself!

Self ID, and the replacing of sex with gender in our equality legislation may have been quietly introduced into Ireland while none of us noticed.

We can't stand by and allow the same to happen again.I've been quietly taking to friends over the last while. None of them agree with self ID or transing children.

I totally agree classicspring

When you think the Greens are going to have to convince rural dwellers to come on.boatd with them. The D6 crew are a given. But the farmers will the ones impacted by measures such as reducing fossil fuels, for things like hedgerow and bog preservation, lowering pesticide use, animal welfare, biodiversity - all these will be met with anger from farmers amd rural dwellers on whom the changes impact the most. Then to turn around and parrot anti - science twaw soundbites, which people know isnt true, and expect their environmental science to be respected. No. An absolute fool move, which I hope Ryan can recognise.

God knows we need a Green movement with plenty of popular support behind it, if anything is going to get done.

Hopefully, common sense will prevail and this will be opposed. However I do find there is a huge lack of awareness about these issues by most people so I wouldn't be surprised if it became legal. With all the environmental issues that the Green party needed to focus on this should not have been a priority for them.

If it was purely homophobia then why was there not a similar furor when Katherine Zappone was previously appointed to the post?

I think he's a smart man but his statement was not great, you couldn't know who Peter Tatchell is without knowing about what he defended previously, I think not just O'Gorman but the whole Green party need to answer why they allowed him to walk with them (presumably was invited) at pride.

Given how many single sex schools there are in Ireland I think that allowing an under 16 to change gender will lead to a lot of lawsuits. They need to expressly clarify what this will mean for single sex spaces before they do this.
Given what Ireland's chief expert Dr. O'Shea has said about the medical pathway that these children are put on, I hope any discussion regarding changing this law involves him and that this whole thing takes place after the Keira Bell case.

www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/q-and-a-consultants-fear-starting-transition-too-quickly-can-be-disastrous-38920160.html
www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/doctors-in-row-with-hse-over-claims-childrens-transgender-care-is-unsafe-38920159.html

That's an excellent interview by Stella O'Malley. Very balanced and full of common sense. She asked a very good question :WHY would anyone want to legally allow under 16's to transition -it just doesn't make any sense.

Homophobic? Roderic O' Gorman is a fool, to claim that.

Reasonable questions about safeguarding, are being asked, by concerned people, many of whom also happen to be Lesbian, Gay, or Bisexual.

It's still allowed Roderic. No one takes an oath, to look the other way because it's you.

We are not concerned about being gay, get over yourself.

It's the company you appear to keep, and his beliefs.

Rightly so, especially, when you make excuses for him, without evidence of a bit of critical thinking, given your responsibilities.

Strengths not supposed to be in there.

His strengths statement is an absolute disgrace.

www.newstalk.com/podcasts/highlights-from-newstalk-breakfast/plans-change-transition-process-transgender-teens

Well worth a listen.

Stella O'Malley was on Newstalk breakfast this morning discussing the proposed change. She was good. Clear

Why not whyou