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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

No ,mostly we wouldn't be fine about it actually

60 replies

Anotherlovelybitofsquirrel · 18/06/2020 16:04

www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2020/06/17/transgender-woman-violence-discrimination-daily-risks-column/3201398001/

Do we want you in our changing room? Do we want to take photos of you. Do we fuck. It's all about him. Not a care for anyone else.

OP posts:
Collidascope · 18/06/2020 17:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 18/06/2020 17:34

She won’t mind - she said she’s happy to share her spaces with transwomen

I hope she has a bigger than average shower then!

merrymouse · 18/06/2020 17:33

Most cisgender women would be completely fine with a trans woman using the showers after a workout

To be fair, anyone who 'identifies with cultural expectations of their sex', probably wouldn't feel it was their place to say no.

Kit19 · 18/06/2020 17:31

Nope I wouldn’t be fine with it either

However jameela is totes fine with it so they can pop round to hers whenever they need a shower

She won’t mind - she said she’s happy to share her spaces with transwomen Grin

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 18/06/2020 17:27

Most cisgender women would be completely fine with a trans woman using the showers after a workout

Lying or delusional? I vote for a bit of both.

NoVegPlease · 18/06/2020 17:25

The faux vulnerability is grating, as if identifying as a woman automatically makes one tender, weak and helpless, even though one is a six-foot ex-soldier

Jaxhog · 18/06/2020 17:24

What struck me is that this TW says JKR is 'claiming to know us from such a clear position of ignorance about our daily lives', yet is claiming EXACTLY that about women's lives!!

FannyCann · 18/06/2020 17:23

Wow. The wonders of photoshop. Wink

"Most cisgender women would be completely fine with a trans woman using the showers after a workout, but do I want to risk ticking off some random transphobe? No. Do I want to risk having someone take photos of me without my consent? No."

Funnily enough that maybe true. Women who are happy to be labelled "cis" just may be happy to share showers, although it is possible they are unaware what it is they are agreeing to and they may get an unexpected shock and fast track up the peak.

Personally I certainly wouldn't risk confronting Clymer. There's a history there. Plus a 6 foot ex military body.

No, I'd turn on my heel and run.

ThinEndoftheWedge · 18/06/2020 17:19

Bless Charlotte - imagine being over 6ft, built like a tank, being a fully paid up member of the class of human being who commits violence against women and girls, worried about a transphobe young girl wanting their own spaces away from males.

Sailfin · 18/06/2020 17:15

You're a bloke, mate. You are not a woman you will never pass for one.

I don't give a fuck how safe you feel.

I don't want you, with your XY chromosomes, in my female only space.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 18/06/2020 17:14

It's also funny that there are so many former military penis having TRAs whose way of behaving is so similar that people get them mixed up. Probably because from a female perspective one large aggressive angry male with military training is much like any other large aggressive angry male with military training in the one's immediate urge is going to be to get the hell away from them before they can hurt you.

Ces6 · 18/06/2020 17:14

Whatever you think about the trans debate, I have been so disappointed with people who I consider intelligent and feminist, blithely hanging on this person's every word and completely ignoring their past behaviour.

toinfinityandlockdown · 18/06/2020 17:12

This article continually implies a position very few gender critical people would adopt and then shows you how unreasonable it is.

  • I believe in protecting trans people's right to be employed, to not be harassed at work, to be treated respectfully
  • I believe that trans women are vulnerable to physical and sexual assault and need protections
-I am in favour of provision in public places that ensures their safety -I believe that it is a condition that causes much distress
  • I believe that people should be able to express their identity however they wish

None of this changes the reality that biological women should be entitled to separate spaces particularly in relation to sports, medicine or issues relating sex such as women fleeing abuse.

None of the above changes the fact that I think gender is a construct and that gender stereotypes need to be resisted.

None of the above changes the fact that children need to be protected from making life damaging or changing decisions about their body, when the objective evidence is that most (I don't claim all) children experiencing gender dysphoria do grow to accept their sex by going through and out the other side.

None of the above changes the fact that a small minority of men will use provision for trans people to gain access to vulnerable women and children.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 18/06/2020 17:12

You're mixing Clymer up with the former pilot (whose name I don't remember either, but the victim of the threat was Ben Shapiro who's a rather small man and who the pilot could clearly have kicked the shit out of, and which the pilot threatened to do).

SarahTancredi · 18/06/2020 17:11

God the photos...always the same filters and angles.

Funnily enough they look nothing like the photos in real life , stood next to actual women. Answers would indeed be very different.

334bu · 18/06/2020 17:10

Did Charlotte not famously on a TV debate physically threaten a right wing guest who refused to acknowledge that people can change sex or am I mixing Charlotte up with somebody else.

merrymouse · 18/06/2020 17:07

Those who've been on the receiving end of an angry tirade from a male they've just rejected before may find all this very familiar.

I agree, and "Don't you dare tell me I'm not who I say I am" is familiar too.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 18/06/2020 17:06

Our bodies are constantly sexualized

Thing is, Charlotte and friends think that "get your penis out of my changing room please" is sexualizing them. Noticing that they have a penis is sexualizing them, telling them that you're a lesbian and therefore will never ever want to touch said penis is sexualizing them.

Those who've been on the receiving end of an angry tirade from a male they've just rejected before may find all this very familiar.

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 18/06/2020 17:04

The hashtag stopclymer (fairly historic but always, it seems, relevant Hmm) on twitter is illuminating if you are unaware of this person.

merrymouse · 18/06/2020 17:02

I am incredibly sorry that J.K. Rowling experienced sexual abuse. I really am. Last year, I was sexually assaulted by a cisgender, heterosexual man in a public space. He groped me

Written a week after the details of JK Rowling's abuse were made public.

She was not just 'groped'.

SapphosRock · 18/06/2020 17:02

I've seen a lot of similar arguments from trans women over the last few days. Two points:

  1. Why do these articles always appeal to the kindness of women? And why don't they get that women are concerned about the safety, privacy and dignity of other women, their mothers, daughters and sisters rather than the validation and comfort of some random on the internet.
  1. Sometimes women don't want you around. If you'd grown up with female socialisation you would pick up on the cues when you're not wanted. We've done it ever since the school playground. Welcome to being a woman! This is how life works.
Prawnofthepatriarchy · 18/06/2020 17:01

Surely whoever commissioned that pile of shit is secretly gender critical? Because it couldn't be clearer how blatantly clueless Clymer is about the reality of women's lives. Not a thought about it must be like to be the victim of sexual assault if you're much weaker than your assailant.

Clymer neither knows nor cares about the sex to whom Clymer claims to belong. Not a scrap. The article displays Clymer's narcissism, solipsism and male socialisation in all their ugliness.

FireUnderTheHand · 18/06/2020 16:57

So tone deaf, so explicitly narc.

Apollo440 · 18/06/2020 16:56

Last year, I was sexually assaulted by a cisgender, heterosexual man in a public space. He groped me, and I was so shocked that I didn't know what to do

Well mate, you're 6ft ex army so you could fight them off. A real woman would be in much greater danger.

Beerincomechampagnetastes · 18/06/2020 16:49

The article posted upthread was very interesting.

Charles Clymer is dedicated to the cause of feminism and you and your magical vagina are going to believe him, like it or not

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