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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

JKR rebuttals from cis women?

192 replies

Treats · 11/06/2020 19:33

I’ve seen a few rebuttals of the JKR statement, but only from trans women or men (mostly with beards). I’m genuinely interested to learn about the ‘other side’ of the issue, but I want to hear it from people who have a female body. I want to hear from someone who’s actually menstruated why they’re comfortable with the term “people who menstruate” instead of “women”, for example.

My natural instinct is with JKR but I work with a lot of people who are horrified by what’s she’s said, and I genuinely want to question my beliefs in this area. But I don’t want a man to tell me what I should think when the question is about what makes women distinctive.

Has anyone seen anything?

OP posts:
Dances · 11/06/2020 20:17

Cis my arse

MrsApplepants · 11/06/2020 20:14

I am a woman, not a cis woman. Please don’t use that term, it’s offensive.

BareBelliedSneetch · 11/06/2020 20:13

I’ve seen plenty of women who are not trans being outraged by JKR. In full trans-ally mode.

And most of them seem to be wilfully misinterpreting what she’s said about menstruating, mostly along the lines of “I don’t have periods, am I a man then?” which is not what she said at all 🙄

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 11/06/2020 20:12

I've seen a bit of backlash on my personal facebook, but then I'm Scottish and run with a very pro-Indy crowd - most of them still hate her for coming out for the union in 2014. They aren't really listening and are very hooked into the SNP agenda that GRA reform is the right, fair and progressive thing to do. It's interesting the bits of her blog that are being cherry picked for sharing.

BaronessFloralBunting · 11/06/2020 20:09

If I can stick up for the OP here - she's asking if there have been any responses from women who would describe themselves as cis, talking about what JKR is supposed to have said/done wrong.

I haven't seen a rebuttal of JKR by a woman about the menstruation question, just a few articles by self described 'cis women' insisting that TWAW and missing the point.

Yes, cis is an insulting, ridiculous term, but it is indeed how any prospective author of such an article would term themselves.

TenShortStories · 11/06/2020 20:05

Lots of women I know in real life (but am not extremely close with) have posted on facebook in horror about JKR and her gender critical views. I haven't seen any commentary on which specific aspects of her argument that they disagree with, just general outrage and posting of videos such as this, which does make a few interesting points but doesn't seem to address some of the main issues with a changing definition of sex (in my opinion):

I'm curious about their staunchly held views and would love to understand which bits of JKR's essay they feel are abhorrent... but don't want to open that can of worms, certainly not on a FB post, so I will watch quietly from the sidelines!

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 11/06/2020 20:03

I am a ‘woman with a female body’ aka a woman. I stand with JKR.

Calling us cis-women makes us a subset of women, so that trans women (90% of whom have had no surgery and have functioning penis and testes) can have ownership of the word ‘woman’. Fuck that shit.

Betty98 · 11/06/2020 19:57

Following with curiosity.

I saw something* that suggested I should be offended by someone saying “women menstruate” because I am a woman who doesn’t happen to menstruate. Baffled me, would never be offended by this or even have considered it.

*the open reply letter from a whole bunch of people I think

InfiniteSheldon · 11/06/2020 19:57

I am a woman not a menstruatir and not your deliberately goady title

TheFormerPorpentiaScamander · 11/06/2020 19:56

Well not all women (as in adult human female) menstruate

Plus theres already a word for us - its women.

LokisLover · 11/06/2020 19:56

I read the statement on her website earlier and I completely stand with what she says.

As I take it she is trying to state that trans lives and their experiences and needs are valid and important but at the same time so are biologically born women’s lives and experiences and needs. I don’t see it as transphobia at all but a protection of women’s rights and safe spaces. I am also scared of voicing these opinions to others in case I am labelled a terf.

But I cannot bear being called cis. I am not a cis anything, I do not understand why women who have always been women have to have that added, who is that for? I am a woman.

I also know I am terrible at concisely putting my point across and I’m sure someone will articulate it much better than I can.

Doggodogington · 11/06/2020 19:54

Should men be labelled as people who have erections? Or people who produce sperm? It’s a bit mad really.

Doggodogington · 11/06/2020 19:51

I’m a woman, not sure what a cis woman is? I also don’t understand why I’d be called person that menstruates? I already have a name it’s woman, I don’t feel the need to change that Confused

RuffleCrow · 11/06/2020 19:50

Please don't call women cis women. There's only one type of woman: adult human female.

BaronessFloralBunting · 11/06/2020 19:48

I've seen messages from PopFems who are very angry with Dr Jessica Taylor for standing up for JKR, and it seems to be thoroughly based in a self-abasing generosity. There have been some thoughtful comments that seem to understand the original article was trying to include female trans people and non binary females, but most women who are popfem in perspective have defaulted to arguing that Transwomen are women and should be included because sisterhood, kind etc. They don't seem to register that they are putting men at the centre of a discussion that should be about women.

BTW, 'cis' women is a term that might get you deleted round these parts, and will certainly, at the very least, put some backs up and cause a long discussion about the term. I actually think it's appropriate here because most Popfems would probably term themselves that way.

Treats · 11/06/2020 19:46

Sorry to offend. I mean women with female bodies. I appreciate that Mumsnet don’t really use cis as a term

OP posts:
beachdreaming2020 · 11/06/2020 19:39

Please define “Cis women” seeing as this is a category from whom you specifically seek feedback

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