New Opt Out Organ Donation System comes into effect today

This thread really is the worst of Mumsnet.

There is no opt out for reproductive tissues on the website BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THE OPT-OUT SYSTEM. You will still have to give express consent to donate them.

Nine pages of frothing that could have been completely avoided if anyone had bothered to check the facts.

It would not be considered socially acceptable to say you are going to differentiate

Maybe it should be made clearer what you can opt out of. Whst does tissue mean in this instance? What tests are done?

I'm really bloody tired so I cant think of more questions but others will I'm sure.

@Bananabixfloof

Many thanks for that.

Moving on, given that it's entirely possible that under the new system, an organ might be taken from someone who had opted out, but the system "wasn't accurate", what mechanisms are in place to deal with (literally) mis-taken organs ?

And yes, fwiw, I wouldn't want anyone having my eggs/ovaries, whatever their sex.

I believe that this sort of policy shift would definitely justify a letter to every household

At the very least, yes.

I think the idea that more information is for some reason undesirable, and instead the state have just decided they'll decide for us, is what I have the most issue with. If the end goal is to increase transplants, then have a concerted campaign and encourage people to sign up.

I think the point is that if society as a whole accepts that gender transition is a thing, wanting to control who gets your reproductive organs would would been seen similarly to wanting to control who gets your other body parts. It would not be considered socially acceptable to say you are going to differentiate.

www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/jul/07/race.world

Sorry but in 1999 I was busy and dont remember this at all or vaguely as a footnote

No-one on this website has ever suggested that they wanted to restrict organs from going to people of other ethnicities.

sigh

I never said they did. I was referring to a story well over a decade ago that ignited quite a fierce debate

I have never seen that. Please provide evidence of your claim.

Since I have already said I would when I could, I find your badgering rude in the extreme. And yes, there is a subtext.

No-one on this website has ever suggested that they wanted to restrict organs from going to people of other ethnicities. I have never seen that. Please provide evidence of your claim. Women here are concerned that reproductive tissues will be removed and used for experimentation including transplanting wombs and vaginas into men or stimulating ovaries into producing eggs that can be used for surrogacy.

In any case, I am not happy that the State have decided to take ownership of my internal organs and I am going to opt-out.

People have (or chose to have, the difference is immaterial) short memories.

I am of an age and waist size that I can recall the near universal disgust in reaction to a story where a donor tried to stipulate that his organs only went to white folk. It was well over 10 years ago. I'll dig up a cite when I can. Unless anyone else also remembers ?

I did read it, Professor. Those were your words. Please explain if you have a different gloss.

ProfessorSlocmbe wants to have a system where a penis can be taken from male and transplanted onto a female. The future is truly going to be nightmarish.

No I don't. But a system where people read and inwardly digest before putting words into other peoples mouths might be nice.

I'm not following or I'm very tired,

If somebody is kind enough to donate their dong, it should go to whoever is in need of a dong, regardless of their previous dong toting status, as well as religion, race, etc etc

Why are "dongs" even mentioned? Far as I know they cant be transplanted, and indeed why would they be. The Male and female bodies are different and neither could sustain the opposite sex' reproductive parts.

I'm missing a huge joke somewhere?

I'd love to see an outreach effort to inform the public of this change (to be clear, I'd prefer that the change wasn't happening at all, but if it is then the public have a right to know), and for major policy changes to be put off until after the public is distracted by Covid in general, but how likely do we think that is to actually happen?

ProfessorSlocmbe wants to have a system where a penis can be taken from male and transplanted onto a female.

The sudden shift to talking about race and religion was rather odd too. Sleight of hand I suppose.

If somebody is kind enough to donate their dong, it should go to whoever is in need of a dong, regardless of their previous dong toting status, as well as religion, race, etc etc.

Let's just all read this comment carefully. Let it sink in (penetrate, lol.)

ProfessorSlocmbe wants to have a system where a penis can be taken from male and transplanted onto a female. The future is truly going to be nightmarish.

And of course if you didn't realize that the system was moving to opt out and therefore didn't make your wishes clear then those wishes might not be respected after your death

I absolutely agree that properly informing the public is important. I imagine the reason this didn't rank higher in the news was a result of the high levels of support for organ donation. That said, I believe that this sort of policy shift would definitely justify a letter to every household as well as a delay in the change until after Covid-19 stops being at the forefront of everyone's concerns (e.g. when effective contact tracing is operative at the earliest but, ideally, when a vaccine becomes widely available).

I think we have 2 separate groups who have issues with that, one group who specifically don't want their reproductive organs or tissues being donated to a male and another who don't want those organs or tissues used by someone else at all.

Hopefully it will remain a long established principle that once organs are in the donation system, the donors wishes can Fuck Right Off, and everything is decided on a clinical basis alone.

We really don't want to begin the journey of people insisting their livers go to Good White Folk or only a devout Muslim or somesuch bollocks.

If somebody is kind enough to donate their dong, it should go to whoever is in need of a dong, regardless of their previous dong toting status, as well as religion, race, etc etc.

And of course if you didn't realize that the system was moving to opt out and therefore didn't make your wishes clear then those wishes might not be respected after your death, which, again, is one of the many reasons why opt out is a terrible idea.

Whats the issue with reproductive organs, some sort of Frankenstein transgender thing ?

I'm in the latter group mentioned by PP. No one gets my ovaries. I refuse to have a child of mine created after my death. Poor thing would have so many questions they'd never be able to answer satisfactorily. I'm theoretically less fussed about fallopian tubes etc.

I think we have 2 separate groups who have issues with that, one group who specifically don't want their reproductive organs or tissues being donated to a male and another who don't want those organs or tissues used by someone else at all.

Whats the issue with reproductive organs, some sort of Frankenstein transgender thing ? Just curious altho I can see some people demanding this surgery as their right to completing their journey to womanhood or am I just tied after four night shifts

Take this statement and think about what the assumptions being made there would mean in a sexual context, if you haven't already. It's not good. Very bad things happen when a society goes down the "well most people would be OK with this, so (shrugs)" path in any context

I'm not proposing mandatory donation, the opportunity to opt out is readily available. I also disagree that not donating is a null choice. This isn't utilitarianism, it's recognising that different beliefs can result in either choice being extremely objectionable.

I see it as more akin to cremation vs burial. Depending on cultural background, a person might find one or the other absolutely abhorrent and every effort should be made to establish which (if either) would best meet the wishes of the deceased. However, if no information is forthcoming, I would find it invidious for a minority group who only permits cremation to suggest that it should be regarded as the default for all, with burial being an option only in the event of explicit wishes being recorded.

Is there a particular reason why you decided that it would be a brilliant idea to start the day off by having a go at someone who's been agreeing with you?

A decent society doesn't just say "well you've been overruled so your wishes don't matter"

I take it you've been out of the "U"K for a while, holidaying on Mars, perhaps ?