75% of the UK’s NHS workers are women. But average hospital protective-wear designed for the average man

Oh dear, G, you're really not very good at this.

Terrible.

I’m also curious as to why nursing is a female dominated profession, yes so many Senior nurses are male. It’s vastly unproportional.

Can't talk about the reasons why that might be, though, as it may upset those with a delicate constitution.

It depends on what constitutes a 'senior nurse'

digital.nhs.uk/data-and-information/find-data-and-publications/supplementary-information/2018-supplementary-information-files/staff-numbers/staff-by-staff-group-grade-gender-and-ethnicity-september

As you can see, there's a much bigger change between bands 6 and 7 than between 5 and 6.

Ok but I thought the masks had to be tightly fitting?

@Rosiepony

PPE does seem to work regardless since the HCPs in ICUs or otherwise exposed to high viral load are not the ones dying.

It's typically HCPs outside of those areas that have. And given the disproportinate numbers of women working in healthcare, the numbers of women HCP deaths are only very slightly higher than men so male HCPs are dying in greater numbers disproportionately in comparison to women HCPs

For a number of proposed reasons.

And the total HCP deaths are not higher than other employed people or the general population anyway. And we can't tell who contracted COVID in or outside work.

I am usually on board with railing against women being fucked over by the patriachy but it's not happening here that I can see.

Oh dear, G, you're really not very good at this.

I’m also curious as to why nursing is a female dominated profession, yes so many Senior nurses are male. It’s vastly unproportional.

Can't talk about the reasons why that might be, though, as it may upset those with a delicate constitution.

On the too big is fine thing, again, no, it is in many cases not fine. In the case of airbags and seatbelts in cars it gets women killed. In the case of Covid I suppose we won't have a full data set for a while, but even from the photos you can see that some female HCPs are swimming in the equipment.

Timeforachange, yes it does mean that it doesn’t work in this case. Too big PPE does not work!

I don’t want more males thanks, but I realise that’s my issue.

I’m so glad you started this thread OP, it’s such a startlingly obvious piece of sexism.

I’m also curious as to why nursing is a female dominated profession, yes so many Senior nurses are male. It’s vastly unproportional.

Most things are designed with an 'upper limit' in mind.

Doesn't mean it doesn't work for people not fulfilling that.

One might ask oneself why people were making that assumption, if one had any level of self awareness.

I didn't wish to attribute to malice that which could be attributed to ignorance.

Seems sensible.

(Puts on hat of superior objectivity, admires reflection in mirror)

One might ask oneself why people were making that assumption, if one had any level of self awareness. Just a helpful suggestion!

And no, while balancing sex distribution across professions is in general a good thing it is not the solution to proper PPE not being provided for women.

The best way to tackle it is by somehow getting more balanced sex ratio in professions

Rather than designing equipment that fits women and institutions buying enough for the men and women who work in situations where it is required.

Seems sensible.

If you somehow forgot that, well, that's your own issue and not the fault of the person pointing it out to you.

I took it into account, I just thought it was strange to assume that I didn't care about nurses receiving PPE but, as you said, that's your own issue. On the issue at hand, it seems like the best way to resolve it in the long term is to create incentives to better balance the sex distribution across professions.

Again, nursing is a female dominated profession, and nurses are needed in both surgical and emergency situations. If you somehow forgot that, well, that's your own issue and not the fault of the person pointing it out to you.

They aren't male dominated, there are just a few more men than is usual for healthcare. Women still need PPE stockpiled for them.

Doesn't the greater number of female healthcare professionals in general practice exaggerate this difference?

Or do you just think that they're not important enough to require PPE?

And FFP3s are required on wards in flu season or for TB, so it really isn't just for surgery or emergency departments anyway.

They aren't male dominated, there are just a few more men than is usual for healthcare. Women still need PPE stockpiled for them.

Are you under the impression that nurses aren't in attendance at surgical and emergency procedures? Or do you just think that they're not important enough to require PPE?

I feel it's slightly less scandalous when the numbers are examined. The main groups routinely requiring PPE (surgical/emergency) are male dominated professions so manufacturing and stockpiling will be based largely on those proportions. I understand that it could be argued that stockpiles should take into account outbreaks like C-19 but I also think that should be balanced against the financial pressures of allowing a huge amount of supplies to be lost to expiry.

source:
digital.nhs.uk/data-and-information/find-data-and-publications/supplementary-information/2018-supplementary-information-files/analysis-of-the-representation-of-women-across-the-hospital-and-community-health-services-workforce

A nurse friend of mine recently failed her FFP3 mask test. She's tall enough to be in the normal height range for men rather than women, which again shows that male and female bodies are different even if you account for the average difference in height.

What that means is that she can't be deployed to certain roles, roles which are critical at this point and for which they need as many people as they can get, for those still in the "surely it doesn't matter if the equipment is designed for men" camp.

I saw a tweet where someone who designs PPE tried to refute this, by showing the standard dummy heads they used to design masks.

4 were definitely male, one was ambiguous (presumably supposed to be the woman).

The dude was like - look, there's a woman model, and seemed to be unable to recognise that there were different sizes for the men, but only one for the 'woman' as if he'd never even realised women came in different sizes too!

Not surprised unfortunately.

The brilliant book Invisible Women by Caroline Criado Perez is all about the "default (white) man" model. It makes my blood boil.

• designed for men

Reminds me of this fascinating article I read last year, which says that the entire world was designed do men.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes

Surely it's the masks start fail rather than the people!