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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Covid-19 and purity spirals

684 replies

DreadPirateLuna · 09/04/2020 13:54

Covid-19 is a very serious illness which threatens our most vulnerable and risks overwhelming the NHS. We should all do what we can to flatten the curve and save lives. People whose behaviour risks lives (e.g. urban residents traveling out to holiday homes in rural communities) should face criticism and sanctions.

However, I can't help feeling that some of the outrage at some behaviours is less about reducing the spread and more about getting caught in a "purity spiral".

Take all the outrage about people in parks. Fresh air and sunshine is good for physical and mental health, it improves the immune system which is particularly important during an epidemic! Many urban residents have no other source of open space except the local park. The ability to get outside can be lifesaving for victims of DV. Risks of contracting disease are very low if you keep your distance from others outside your household.

Yet I've seen photos of walkers and family groups in parks, keeping far away from others, but accused of selfishness and killing the elderly and disrespecting the NHS. Parks in London have been closed, meaning more congestion of other areas and residents confined to homes, which is damaging for reasons outlined above.

And it's usually (though not exclusively) women and esp mothers who get blamed. Those selfish Karens and their broods.

A more sensible solution would be to allow restricted access to the parks. Maybe allow only locals in nearby flats without gardens. But it seems we're not doing sensible these days.

OP posts:
Ereshkigalangcleg · 10/04/2020 19:57

I can't eat treats, no carbs, no wheat, no gluten, no dairy, can't drink alcohol because of immunosuppressants I'm on, can't even go outside for a walk now. A treat that would make my life more bearable right now would be to go and visit my kids. So,that's ok right? Because it isn't about doing the right thing it's about ourselves and what's right for us as individuals right?

It's not a race to the bottom Hmm I'm sorry you can't do those things, but if I want a little treat to brighten my day I will have one, while following government advice. You have the internet obviously? Not everyone does, it's non essential, so you need to stop using it, don't you?

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 10/04/2020 19:54
Wine

I'm having my evil unnecessary tea as we speak.

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:53

Right I'm off to join my friends on Zoom and drink my Contraband. It will be like being in a Speakeasy.

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:51

None is arguing that you can be in a shop as long as you like, just aren't up for enforcing conditions on time and monitoring everyone. It's an important difference.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:46

Given that we are being implored to stay at home, that we aren't allowed to go and sit in a park, that we aren't allowed to drive to see family, even maintaining distancing I cannot see the logic in allowing people to browse through supermarkets looking at dvds, candles, bedding, cushions, clothes, picture frames etc. You are prolonging the time you, other shoppers and staff are exposed and it makes no sense.

Why close certain shops if it's ok to shop? Why has Primark had to close but the clothing department in a supermarket is open? It makes no sense. There is clearly a risk to being in a shop so why argue that you should be in a shop for as long as you like, while others have to wait outside for you to finish?

DidoLamenting · 10/04/2020 19:40

The VAT point is ridiculous.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 10/04/2020 19:40

There is no banned list. Various people, including some members of the police, have been making their own judgements about what they think should be banned and pretending that the government guidelines give them the authority to do so (they don't).

scaevola · 10/04/2020 19:35

"Why dont we ban all items which charge VAT?"

Because VAT is a general consumption tax, not a luxury tax

DidoLamenting · 10/04/2020 19:34

I might possibly not have been paying full attention but there isn't a banned list?

The Government recognised wine is essential. And presumably chocolate and cake and things to make cake with.

I've been out for a walk every day- between 30 to 60 minutes. It's a mixture of streets and a locked private communal garden to which I have access. There has been no difficulty keeping 2m distance.

A couple of times I've gone past Waitrose but haven't gone in. Just along from Waitrose there are several small independent grocers and cheese shops which are open. I've bought stuff from them. One of them stocks Jerusalem artichokes, fennel bulbs, white asparagus, kohlrabi and eddo roots, all of which I bought. Are these essential? They are fresh food and if it's not bought it will rot. It took me less than a minute. There was a one other person in the shop.

I also passed 2 art galleries which sit in their own extensive grounds- the grounds are open. There were 2 or 3 people separated by many, many, many metres.

I gave up alcohol at the end of 2018. I lost the taste for it and didn't miss it at all. If I open wine now it's for cooking. I needed 100ml of wine for a recipe today and the only wine I had was a Prosecco. It worked well in the recipe. I'm drinking a glass. First glass of wine in 15 months. I'm enjoying it.

museumum · 10/04/2020 19:28

This purity judginess is actually the thing causing me most stress about this whole situation.
Never mind that we might all die, that my income is halved yet I’m still trying to simultaneously work from home and parent and the economy is fucked.
THE worst thing is the petty judginess. Being tutted at for Perfectly within the guidelines behaviours is causing me serious anxiety symptoms.
Fuck off sanctimonious preachers.

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:27

There aren't enough lols for that last comment.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:23

Or we could just let people but what’s available in the supermarkets and remind ourselves that you don’t get Covid 19 from buying cakes instead of turnips.

No you don't. But you do catch it from people and fomites, and the longer you are around them the higher the risk.

You have made no mention of the government.

And? I definitely have said on a thread today that I blame the government. So what if I haven't said it on this thread? You've referenced every thought and opinion that you have, have you?

Haworthia · 10/04/2020 19:21

Absolutely a purity spiral. I’ve actually been quite shocked by the amount of rage and resentment shown by some (quite large!) sections of society which has CLEARLY been simmering just underneath the surface all along.

It’s not just the policing of people out in parks, it’s the policing of shopping habits (ban all non-essential products!) right down to a thread recently, hand-wringingly asking for permission to go to Superdrug for some shower gel and a lipstick. I think the consensus was you absolutely weren’t able to browse for long, and did you really need to visit the make up aisle?

DJLippy · 10/04/2020 19:19

We dont need Hooves to make a list the government has already worked out which items are luxuries.

Why dont we ban all items which charge VAT? With all those government cheques being issues I'm sure the exchequer would love to loose all that tax revenue.

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:18

Bollocks. You have made no mention of the government. You have been on this thread all day pointing fingers at plonk buyers, and candles buyers for some bizarre reason. Presumably the candle thing is from some random post on a thread, or has Jo Malone been inundated with panic buyers?

Binterested · 10/04/2020 19:18

Or we could just let people but what’s available in the supermarkets and remind ourselves that you don’t get Covid 19 from buying cakes instead of turnips.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:16

So cake is fine, but tampons aren't?

We can exempt certain toiletries

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:15

So people will be given lists of things that have VAT on them that they should not buy ? Even though they are available to buy?

Nope, they can just be blocked off by shops. Easy to do. Alcohol used to be covered when we had tighter licensing laws.

isabellerossignol · 10/04/2020 19:14

How about items that you don't pay VAT on?

So cake is fine, but tampons aren't?

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 10/04/2020 19:14

Salt good, sugar bad?

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:14

I've pointed many a finger at the government actually. When this is over they need to be held fully accountable for the decisions that have led us to this point, for all the deaths of healthcare workers caused by lack of PPE, for the under funding of the NHS that left us with such woeful cspacity,.

No doubt though, the public will have short memories and the same ones who are currently clapping for the NHS won't be voting for a government who will properly fund and support the NHS, pay healthcare workers properly or re instate student nurse bursaries. But you no precisely nothing about what I campaign for.

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:12

Ha ha ha
So people will be given lists of things that have VAT on them that they should not buy ? Even though they are available to buy?

I suppose it would be good reading material for the queues.

You could also hand out other Right Think material while people are waiting. Shame to miss the opportunity.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:10

They could be on the permitted list

Dances · 10/04/2020 19:09

Upthread. On one of your many 'Do as you are told' posts.

How about answering the actual question about why you are finger pointing at Easter egg buyers and not the incompetence of the government?

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 10/04/2020 19:09

How about items that you don't pay VAT on?

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