Covid-19 and purity spirals

I came over here to get away from the covid posts...

Yes, we hope so too. Sounds like there is just as much chance of you catching it from your husband.

Not really seeing as we are social distancing at all times. Are you with your gd? Always two metres apart are you?

Why don't you ring for help from the many local organisations or neighbourhood groups can offer assistance, then. They exist for that reason. That way your husband wouldn't have to risk going to a supermarket - and infecting himself, or others.......

So, we should ask someone else to put themselves in danger to help us? How does that work? Quite who it is we are meant to ring anyway I don't know. That's why we have to shop for our neighbour - she's still waiting to get the shielded food box. Won't hold our breath waiting for someone to do our shopping. But, you know, carry on breaking the rules and justify it to yourself based on me following the rules.

Or perhaps the neighbour he shop[s for; or perhaps people at the supermarket; or perhaps people at work.......turns out your situation is not quite so text book perfect, either. Or if it is...it doesn't sound like your situation is any less risky than mine. At least none of my family are going out to a workplace.....

Yes. Unless you stop everyone from going out at all, there is a risk. As I said, it is about minimising all unnecessary risk. You are still going shopping - that is a risk that you cannot remove.

We aren't then visiting my parents to spread it to them too. That's the difference.

You are permitted to go shopping, you are permitted to go to work. You are not permitted to mix households. That is the difference.

So hooves how are the WHO/government proposing to stop a population with no immunity getting the virus?

I've already said. By doing what South Korea and Singapore and China are doing - testing everyone, tracking movement, contact tracing and quarantine. They are doing it now. They've contained the spread and aren't in lockdown and aren't having exponential spread.

They are using various tracking apps and apparently the US,UK and German governments are looking at different tracking apps to use.

They cannot allow exponential growth through the population or keep locking the country down for two or three months every two months.

The quickest a vaccine has ever been developed ever is four years. They can't keep that up for four years.

It's about reducing contacts wherever we can. You don't want to hear though. Let's hope your DD doesn't get it and infect your husband

Yes, we hope so too. Sounds like there is just as much chance of you catching it from your husband.

We don't have anyone who can shop for us

Why don't you ring for help from the many local organisations or neighbourhood groups can offer assistance, then. They exist for that reason. That way your husband wouldn't have to risk going to a supermarket - and infecting himself, or others.......

See how it works?

Justhadathought

As I have said, we are following, to the letter, all government guidelines for someone shielding. Literally, to the letter.

You however are not.

Yes, I would love him to stay at home. But the official advice is that he doesn't have to shield. I have to isolate from him and sleep in a separate room, eat separately, not use the kitchen at the same time as him, clean the bathroom after he uses it etc. We are doing every single thing that we have been told to. You aren't.

Ultimately, if he gets it he may pass it to me,but it will stop there because I am not seeing anyone. So our extra spread would be one person - me

Or perhaps the neighbour he shop[s for; or perhaps people at the supermarket; or perhaps people at work.......turns out your situation is not quite so text book perfect, either. Or if it is...it doesn't sound like your situation is any less risky than mine. At least none of my family are going out to a workplace.....

But do you know what......I'm not into judging others; especially when I have no awareness of the practical details of their life. Most of us are doing what we can manage within our circumstances...and keeping to the guidelines about social distancing and about cleanliness.

So hooves how are the WHO/government proposing to stop a population with no immunity getting the virus?

If they plan on letting it spread to infect 70% of the population they will have to shut down every two months for two or three months. They can't do it.

It's horrible. I don't think we can shut down every couple of months like this. But there is no plan for it to spread to 70% of the population. It just will. Because we have no way of stopping it.

There is no answer to this. But just saying "it won't because we can't deal with it" is wishful thinking. It is going to, our only control really is how fast that happens.

arrangmenent

As for my husband shopping - how are we meant to do this? He is shopping for our neighbour who is also shielding plus he still has to go to work

So it turns out that your husband is actually working outside of the home......unlike any of my family...and yet you have the friggin' nerve to go on and on and on. If you are so personally vulnerable, and can hardly eat anything,, and can't even go in your own garden...perhaps he shouldn't go to work, then. Have you considered that? Or is it that your family necessities, practicalities and arrangmenets are simply more important than those of others?

So then the extra spread is between her and her neighbour ( via the shopping) and between her and whoever she crosses paths with at the supermarket.

It's about reducing contacts wherever we can. You don't want to hear though. Let's hope your DD doesn't get it and infect your husband.

Any spread between your house and your DDS is entirely unnecessary and any associated spread is unnecessary. You say there are only two people in her house but then go onto say about her going shopping, plus her elderly neighbour plus if she's working

I've explained to you - but you don't want to hear, for your own reasons.

There is not much spread possible between the two households because she only goes to the supermarket, and to my house......she does not go out to work. She lives alone. She drops the shopping off at the neighbour's doorstep. The neighbours communicate entirely by What's APP.

I've had enough of this, and of you raging on and on......

What the World Health Organisation aren't experts?

Read WHO they are the experts

Who are the WHO experts? What makes them more expert than leading uk experts?

alloutoffucks

Yep, it's pretty obvious that it is unworkable

Read WHO they are the experts and say quite clearly that most people getting it is the wrong approach.

Justhadathought

Think about it.

This appeared in the UK in January. By march we were locked down because spread threatened to overwhelm the NHS. That might yield about 10% infected after six weeks lockdown.

If they plan on letting it spread to infect 70% of the population they will have to shut down every two months for two or three months. They can't do it.

Our CMO originally said 80% would catch it. They know now that it's wrong.

Most of us are going to get it because it is a new virus,

No we aren't. We can't because neither the NHS nor the economy can support that. You are simply wrong. The plan will be to stop the spread after lockdown

I think they're aiming to increase the NHS capacity so that most of us can get it without overwhelming the NHS. This is combined with slowing the pace - there has been plenty of talk about off/on lockdown (or at least partial measures) and an article today suggested schools and business might reopen but with prolonged distancing recommendations in place - wfh where possible, avoiding gatherings, limit transport, and so on. This is to slow the spread, but it's not going to stop it. They also made it pretty clear the other day that border closures aren't an option they favours which means it will continue to come in to the country.

They're still very actively building the nightingale hospitals and announcing more. At least some of those will not be ready for this peak. They are going to be needed longer term as this isn't going away.

Justhadathought

But I have explained it to you.

Any spread between your house and your DDS is entirely unnecessary and any associated spread is unnecessary. You say there are only two people in her house but then go onto say about her going shopping, plus her elderly neighbour plus if she's working.

All of those infections wouldn't happen if you and your gd didn't mix.

As for my husband shopping - how are we meant to do this? He is shopping for our neighbour who is also shielding plus he still has to go to work. We don't have anyone who can shop for us, can't get a delivery and the guidelines specifically say that other household members do not have to shield. We have to maintain strict social distancing at home which we do. He undresses at the front door, clothes straight into washing machine, him in shower, we eat and sleep separately, clean bathroom every time he uses it, stay at least two metres apart at all times.

We are following, to the letter, the government guidelines.

Ultimately, if he gets it he may pass it to me,but it will stop there because I am not seeing anyone. So our extra spread would be one person - me.

We are doing exactly what the guidelines tell us to do. Quite happy for you to criticise me when you can say the same

Most of us aren't going to get it. Think about it. Currently, studies are showing between 10 and 15% of a population has had it. That means 85 - 90% haven't had it

German Chancellor Angela Merkel has said that up to 70% of the German population will likely contract the coronavirus, suggesting that the government’s priority is about “slowing its spread

When the virus is out there, the population has no immunity and no therapy exists, then 60 to 70% of the population will be infected,” Merkel told a news conference in Berlin on Wednesday, according to Reuters. The country has over 82 million citizens

The process has to be focused on not overburdening the health system by slowing the virus’s spread. It’s about winning time

Most of us are going to get it because it is a new virus, so we have no inherited immunity, or partial immunity from exposure to similar viruses (which is what protects most of us from flu and winter colds becoming serious). Covid is now spreading widely in the community, so we can't eradicate it. The only way we can reduce it is by building immunity in our populations either through infection or vaccination (at least 18 months away).

The distancing is to slow the spread, as illustrated in this (old) article
www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/world/corona-simulator/?utm_campaign=wp_main&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook

I'm not saying this to minimise the situation. It's horrible. But in reality the risk of just seeing her granddaughter is to her and her family and really has a negligible impact on everyone else.

Quite. You don't have to justify yourself to us just. I'd argue caring for your GD could fall into the vulnerable people category laid out by the govt, depending on the circs. And it is actually no one elses business

Thanks! And you're right.....there is a certain amount of vulnerability in my daughter's situation...hence our heavy load of responsibility.