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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What constitutes modern day feminism

635 replies

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 10:45

What does it mean to be a feminist in the 21st century? When I and indeed the members of my family who I would consider to be feminist were growing up it was about fighting for equal rights for women such as equal pay and better representation of women in high powered jobs and given that the Labour Party has yet again elected a male leader says to me that there is still along way to go. However I and my family members find ourselves becoming more and more uncomfortable with what some might call the more extreme side of feminism.

I fear that certain views of feminism are allowing a rather unhealthy and quite hateful form especially in relation to trans rights. As a member of the lgbt community and although I’m not trans myself I do have friends who are and I also volunteer for a local charity who support and offer counselling to trans teenagers. I see first hand the damage done by the attitudes promoted and supported by some sections of the feminist community dressed up under the guise of ‘free speech’. The trans right issue is a complex one. I don’t think children should be allowed to transition or be given hormone blockers to prevent puberty because I’m not convinced a child has the maturity to make those kind of life changing decisions although that doesn’t mean I don’t believe that children can’t be trans because I see it everyday through my work with the charity and it’s a fact of great shame that at least 70% of young trans have self harmed or tried to commit suicide because of the prejudice they face.

The biggest contentious issue appears to be that of self indentification. I fail to see how it erodes my rights as a women if a trans person chooses to self identify and personally I find the notion that people chose to self identify because they want to harm others somewhat far fetched. Yes I accept that there are some sick indivuals that do this but the fact is the majority of sex offenders offend as men not men who are self identifying as female or the other wan around. I remember mixed sex changing rooms when I was growing up and I don’t remember a vast increase in sexual assay because of it.

Now despite being accused of it on here several times by people who hide behind the guise of feminism to attack anyone who dares to defend trans rights as someone who condones sexual assault I do not in fact as a surviour of sexual assault I find that extremely offensive. Anyone trans or otherwise who commits any kind of sexual assault deserves to be castrated and strung up. Maybe one way around the shared changing room or toilet issue would be to have single cubicles or toilets as we do at our charity so it doesn’t matter who uses them because there’s only u on there. As a parent and someone who works with children who have been absued I can totally understand the argument for parents wanting to know who the child is sharing a changing room with. Personally I wouldn’t allow my son or my nieces who I regularly look after our without a grown up until they were of teenager age and then allow in groups of friends.

I’ve no doubt that this post will either be ignored or removed as mums net seems to remove anything that resembles some who supports the rights of trans people but just as the people who use feminism to try and erode or stand Agasint trans rights I to have the right to express my opinion.

The debate of feminism and trans issues needs to be less toxic and more about open discussion and tolerance of others opinions will allowing healthy debate because trans people are people and have the same right to be heard and to be given the same freedoms as any other member of society. Do I think that all feminists are transphobic absolutely not and neither do I believe that all of the trans community min are good people. There’s good and bad in everyone and every group of society but since when is that a justification for the discrimination of a whole part of society

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Michelleoftheresistance · 06/04/2020 09:54

It was fairly obvious from the title.

When someone tries to explain that the new and better and modern (and Other Words Too) feminism centres males over females, then plot = lost.

It's an attempt to rebrand feminism by male supremacism, because they find feminism fucking inconvenient. I see their problem. However being a feminist (and centreing females) I am able to confidently say 'that's not my job to fix for you'.

R0wantrees · 06/04/2020 09:52

More lies and misinformation from TRA posters who come solely to call us bigots whilst refusing to engage with the opinions of anyone else in a very, erm, bigoted manner?

False allegations in specific dynamics are usefully understood as often being projections/admissions.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3452784-Coercive-Control-a-need-for-better-awareness

OneEpisode · 06/04/2020 09:38

A lot of ordinary women would have seen this thread. Some would have posted. I made one post and I have been ignoring feminism for decades. It was the misogyny behind trump’s election, and fwr that meant I har to remove my blinkers.

DickKerrLadies · 06/04/2020 09:06

Erm... that went weird.

More lies and misinformation from TRA posters who come solely to call us bigots whilst refusing to engage with the opinions of anyone else in a very, erm, bigoted manner?

Just another day in the land of Genderism.

I was going to quote some posts but there's so many that it would be a bit weird but I will add this gem from Datun where she wonderfully sums up the OP's thoughts on the transpeople OP knows.

So they're rational, but most of them try to kill themselves or self harm. They believe you can change sex which is an example of that rational thinking. You know all about their genitalia, but think that other people are obsessed with it if they question it.

All I can hope is that OP actually went and thought about all the inconsistencies and illogical things about what she believes. Not much chance though - the cognitive dissonance must be excruciating.

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 05/04/2020 23:47

I tried for years to find out the correct name and recipe for the "Dutch Baby" I had been served at a restaurant when I was a child. Felt a bit silly to discover it is the same as sweet yorkshire pudding just baked in a hot buttery frying pan instead of individual pots.

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 05/04/2020 23:40

Popovers are Yorkshire pudding Shock I didn’t know that (& clearly it was never important enough to a story line for me to find out!)

I think pancakes with bacon is equivalent to Yorkshire pudding with roast?

My Yorkshire mother was brought up with pudding & syrup as her Friday after school treat Grin

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 05/04/2020 23:40

The eight hour time difference means I am always a day late and a dollar short, as it were. I thought you had the midnight misogynist on the line but it turns out it was a different misogynist altogether.

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 23:18

I forget you’re not over here thebewilderness

It always feels like you should be here

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 05/04/2020 23:16

We call them popovers in the US. I make the sweet vanilla kind every week and serve them with creme anglaise.

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 05/04/2020 23:12

When I and indeed the members of my family who I would consider to be feminist were growing up it was about fighting for equal rights for women such as equal pay and better representation of women in high powered jobs and given that the Labour Party has yet again elected a male leader says to me that there is still along way to go. However I and my family members find ourselves becoming more and more uncomfortable with what some might call the more extreme side of feminism.

Feminism is the political movement for the liberation of women.
What you are describing are the symptoms of the problem and not the problem itself. The problem is the dominance/submission paradigm designed and enforced by the patriarchy, i.e. the rule of the fathers.
Feminism hasn't changed. It is people's perception of feminism that has changed as a result of the anti feminist backlash marketing a political movement as a lifestyle choice.
Feminism is not the first or the only political movement the titans of capitalism has defanged in this fashion.

ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings · 05/04/2020 23:12

I feel like a whole new world has opened before me!

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:47

There you go

What constitutes modern day feminism
RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:45

bygrabthars

Ive seen roast dinner in a yorkshire (pancake) wrap

So yeah

ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings · 05/04/2020 22:42

So... If syrup can go on Yorkshire puddings... Can pancakes go with roast dinners and have gravy on them?

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:24

I've had some really intriguing conversations with myself

I’ll bet you have Grin

Hope you haven’t got long left

Ive got til thursday...but I’m not stuck in my bedroom

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 22:22

Me too. In my bastard bedroom isolating too. I've had some really intriguing conversations with myself. You know that previous post where I manage to out manoeuvre my own argument on sweet/savoury toppings? I've been trouncing and retrouncing myself in arguments all day.

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:12

Ive been indoors for a long time

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:11

Rufus, did you just enthusiastically respond to your own post about parmesan yorkshires? I luff you so much

Grin

Yes....

I suddenly remembered i have milk and flour and eggs and parmesan

And a yorkshire pudding baking tray!

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:10

but we all know that's a load of crepe

Hahahahahaha

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 22:09

Rufus, did you just enthusiastically respond to your own post about parmesan yorkshires? I luff you so muchGrin

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:07

Oh my god i am so making those tomorrow!!

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 22:07

Oooh i got a recipe for yorkies with parmesan cheese on top

Just to have as a snack...

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 22:05

Yes, but the real mystery is how pancakes and yorkshires can have the same ingredients and turn out as clearly very different food items.

What alchemy turns eggs, flour and milk into a big floofy thing in one case, and a flat floppy thing in another? I'd make a pun about identity, but we all know that's a load of crepe.

PertEllaTitsahoy · 05/04/2020 22:00

Why cant I read a thread properly 😂 floral said it already

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 05/04/2020 21:59

pert

Yup Grin

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