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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What constitutes modern day feminism

635 replies

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 10:45

What does it mean to be a feminist in the 21st century? When I and indeed the members of my family who I would consider to be feminist were growing up it was about fighting for equal rights for women such as equal pay and better representation of women in high powered jobs and given that the Labour Party has yet again elected a male leader says to me that there is still along way to go. However I and my family members find ourselves becoming more and more uncomfortable with what some might call the more extreme side of feminism.

I fear that certain views of feminism are allowing a rather unhealthy and quite hateful form especially in relation to trans rights. As a member of the lgbt community and although I’m not trans myself I do have friends who are and I also volunteer for a local charity who support and offer counselling to trans teenagers. I see first hand the damage done by the attitudes promoted and supported by some sections of the feminist community dressed up under the guise of ‘free speech’. The trans right issue is a complex one. I don’t think children should be allowed to transition or be given hormone blockers to prevent puberty because I’m not convinced a child has the maturity to make those kind of life changing decisions although that doesn’t mean I don’t believe that children can’t be trans because I see it everyday through my work with the charity and it’s a fact of great shame that at least 70% of young trans have self harmed or tried to commit suicide because of the prejudice they face.

The biggest contentious issue appears to be that of self indentification. I fail to see how it erodes my rights as a women if a trans person chooses to self identify and personally I find the notion that people chose to self identify because they want to harm others somewhat far fetched. Yes I accept that there are some sick indivuals that do this but the fact is the majority of sex offenders offend as men not men who are self identifying as female or the other wan around. I remember mixed sex changing rooms when I was growing up and I don’t remember a vast increase in sexual assay because of it.

Now despite being accused of it on here several times by people who hide behind the guise of feminism to attack anyone who dares to defend trans rights as someone who condones sexual assault I do not in fact as a surviour of sexual assault I find that extremely offensive. Anyone trans or otherwise who commits any kind of sexual assault deserves to be castrated and strung up. Maybe one way around the shared changing room or toilet issue would be to have single cubicles or toilets as we do at our charity so it doesn’t matter who uses them because there’s only u on there. As a parent and someone who works with children who have been absued I can totally understand the argument for parents wanting to know who the child is sharing a changing room with. Personally I wouldn’t allow my son or my nieces who I regularly look after our without a grown up until they were of teenager age and then allow in groups of friends.

I’ve no doubt that this post will either be ignored or removed as mums net seems to remove anything that resembles some who supports the rights of trans people but just as the people who use feminism to try and erode or stand Agasint trans rights I to have the right to express my opinion.

The debate of feminism and trans issues needs to be less toxic and more about open discussion and tolerance of others opinions will allowing healthy debate because trans people are people and have the same right to be heard and to be given the same freedoms as any other member of society. Do I think that all feminists are transphobic absolutely not and neither do I believe that all of the trans community min are good people. There’s good and bad in everyone and every group of society but since when is that a justification for the discrimination of a whole part of society

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Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:33

The people I work with are some of the most rationale people I have ever met and they believe that sex can change

But I am guessing that you don't believe it OP!

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:33

Any discrimination is wrong

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wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 05/04/2020 14:33

There's no such thing as being born in the wrong body.

BovaryX · 05/04/2020 14:32

The people I work with are some of the most rationale people I have ever met

I thought you said they were self harming? Didn't you kick this off by claiming trans people were more prone to self harm than anyone else? Do you think self harm is indicative of rationality?

Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:32

BTW I am perfectly happy for trans women (at least adult ones) to dress and act as they like. If they think they are women then that it is their business. However, this isn't the same as saying that everyone else has to accept their inner personal beliefs as truth, is it?

MrsDoylesTeaBags · 05/04/2020 14:32

"How come the original post was literate and the OP's updates aren't?" Gin Gin Gin

ThinkIveFoundYourMarbles · 05/04/2020 14:31

Do you think we could persuade Mumsnet to design a sea-lion emoji?

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:31

Do you always just accept anything anyone tells you on face value?

Adults working with vulnerable children have a core responsibility to reflective practice informed by evidence-base & Safeguarding frameworks

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:30

And worth mentioning that Bespin was banned after a long time being teflon while discussing their work with vulnerable LGBTQ+ teenagers and challenging the point of basic safeguarding.

Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:30

They define as feeling like they have be born into the wrong body
Yes, you have already said that. But don't you see that's not an answer as to why anybody else should believe it? If I don't believe in "wrong bodies" (which is a quasi-religious idea tbh) then why do I have to pretend to believe it or be called a bigot? Surely you can see that forcing someone to accept others' beliefs is pretty bigoted?

BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:30

They might believe that. I could believe that I am a rich millionaire, unfortunately it doesn't make it true.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:29

The people I work with are some of the most rationale people I have ever met and they believe that sex can change

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BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:29

So you are saying being a woman is just a feeling)?

midgebabe · 05/04/2020 14:29

And I have seen the pain and discrimination that females face just for being female

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:28

Stunning lack of understanding about safeguarding for someone in that role, too, iirc.

Worryingly so.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:28

They define as feeling like they have be born into the wrong body

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Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:28
  • Most rational people don't believe that sex can change.
BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:28

How do transwomen become women?

As far as I'm concerned they are transwomen and a subset of men. Just as transmen are a subset of women.

Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:27

Why does not believing that sex can change make you a bigot? Most rational people believe don't believe that sex can change. You have yet to even explain WHY we should believe this but apparently we just should, without question? Confused Do you always just accept anything anyone tells you on face value?

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:27

And you need to be a pretty bitter individual to be bigot

bigot
/ˈbɪɡət/

noun
a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:27

Yes, R0, I believe it was. Stunning lack of understanding about safeguarding for someone in that role, too, iirc.

BovaryX · 05/04/2020 14:27

I think you need to be a pretty dangerous individual with a pretty dangerous ideology to encourage someone like Keira Bell to take part in damaging medical treatment and surgery. How many more Keira Bells?

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:26

I have seen the pain humiliation discrimination that trans women have been through to be defined as female

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R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:25

Gotta say, the incoherence on display is Bespin level. Not that I'm saying the repeated use of the phrase "transwomen are just as much a woman as I am" is telling at all. Would never suggest that.

Its funny Floral, I was recalling Bespin's frequent posts about work. Mesmac wasnt it?

DixieFlatline · 05/04/2020 14:25

Oh god, I had blissfully forgotten about Bespin Shock though I prefer the incoherence to the increasing number of sock-puppety wankers playing devil’s advocate on any thread about men recently.

Back to the current topic: funny how so many of these people accuse us of reducing women to their genitals while evidently believing the entirety of a man’s maleness resides in his appendage.