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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What constitutes modern day feminism

635 replies

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 10:45

What does it mean to be a feminist in the 21st century? When I and indeed the members of my family who I would consider to be feminist were growing up it was about fighting for equal rights for women such as equal pay and better representation of women in high powered jobs and given that the Labour Party has yet again elected a male leader says to me that there is still along way to go. However I and my family members find ourselves becoming more and more uncomfortable with what some might call the more extreme side of feminism.

I fear that certain views of feminism are allowing a rather unhealthy and quite hateful form especially in relation to trans rights. As a member of the lgbt community and although I’m not trans myself I do have friends who are and I also volunteer for a local charity who support and offer counselling to trans teenagers. I see first hand the damage done by the attitudes promoted and supported by some sections of the feminist community dressed up under the guise of ‘free speech’. The trans right issue is a complex one. I don’t think children should be allowed to transition or be given hormone blockers to prevent puberty because I’m not convinced a child has the maturity to make those kind of life changing decisions although that doesn’t mean I don’t believe that children can’t be trans because I see it everyday through my work with the charity and it’s a fact of great shame that at least 70% of young trans have self harmed or tried to commit suicide because of the prejudice they face.

The biggest contentious issue appears to be that of self indentification. I fail to see how it erodes my rights as a women if a trans person chooses to self identify and personally I find the notion that people chose to self identify because they want to harm others somewhat far fetched. Yes I accept that there are some sick indivuals that do this but the fact is the majority of sex offenders offend as men not men who are self identifying as female or the other wan around. I remember mixed sex changing rooms when I was growing up and I don’t remember a vast increase in sexual assay because of it.

Now despite being accused of it on here several times by people who hide behind the guise of feminism to attack anyone who dares to defend trans rights as someone who condones sexual assault I do not in fact as a surviour of sexual assault I find that extremely offensive. Anyone trans or otherwise who commits any kind of sexual assault deserves to be castrated and strung up. Maybe one way around the shared changing room or toilet issue would be to have single cubicles or toilets as we do at our charity so it doesn’t matter who uses them because there’s only u on there. As a parent and someone who works with children who have been absued I can totally understand the argument for parents wanting to know who the child is sharing a changing room with. Personally I wouldn’t allow my son or my nieces who I regularly look after our without a grown up until they were of teenager age and then allow in groups of friends.

I’ve no doubt that this post will either be ignored or removed as mums net seems to remove anything that resembles some who supports the rights of trans people but just as the people who use feminism to try and erode or stand Agasint trans rights I to have the right to express my opinion.

The debate of feminism and trans issues needs to be less toxic and more about open discussion and tolerance of others opinions will allowing healthy debate because trans people are people and have the same right to be heard and to be given the same freedoms as any other member of society. Do I think that all feminists are transphobic absolutely not and neither do I believe that all of the trans community min are good people. There’s good and bad in everyone and every group of society but since when is that a justification for the discrimination of a whole part of society

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FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:45

So damn Bespin.

Like, textbook.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:45

I think attitudes like this will die out there have been huge changes in the history of the lgbt plus community gay people can now get married and have kids something unheard of 10-20 years ago and in another 20 years this won’t be an issue especially now schools are introducing lgbt plus awareness in schools the next generation will be far more accepting and tolerant

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ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings · 05/04/2020 14:45

Glad I'm not the only one getting strong Bespin vibes from this!

OP, have you considered spending your time as a fictional teacher/nursery nurse/charity worker at this fictional charity/school/nursery to better learn about the basics of safeguarding so you can help the fictional teenagers/preschoolers in your care; instead of discussing in apparently minute detail the nature of you fictional trans colleagues genitals? Might be a more appropriate use of your time, don't you think? In fact, probably best not to ask any of your colleagues about their genitals at all really.

Helmetbymidnight · 05/04/2020 14:45

these type of posters all start off so self-righteous and self-regarding then it descends into dim and dimmer.

BovaryX · 05/04/2020 14:45

I believe that trans people are murdered abused attack and discriminated agasint because who they are you

You think trans people are the most persecuted group, yet you fail to provide any statistical support for this. You stated a 12 year old child was 'trans' and when challenged to explain what precisely that means you are silent. Your contribution here has been a litany of unsubstantiated claims and baseless allegations of 'bigotry.' Sorry. No sale.

1Micem0use · 05/04/2020 14:44

I'm a labour party member. I voted for Keir Starmer based on merit, not gender. I believe in gender equality, I'm a feminist. I felt he was the best candidate. A male being elected is not in and of itself sexism.

Justhadathought · 05/04/2020 14:44

I believe that trans women are women and should be treated as such equally the same with trans men

Obviously in a plural individualistic society you are entitled to your beliefs, but for most people, and for science, the sexed body is what makes a man or a woman. Nothing else.

Personal expression of individuality is quite a different thing altogether...and that is the precise goal of most liberation movements. Being free to be and express your self, regardless of your sex. Only in more primitive/repressive cultures are people now restricted to only certain rigid roles on account of their sex.

You cannot change sex though. Sex is real and has real implications on many levels.

MrsSnippyPants · 05/04/2020 14:44

In my opinion you are neither a woman or a teacher. So there you go 'pet'.

DixieFlatline · 05/04/2020 14:43

I’m not sure starting a thread and then putting your 13-year-old in charge of the replies counts as useful homeschooling.

scotsheather · 05/04/2020 14:42

The people I work with are some of the most rationale people I have ever met and they believe that sex can change

My friend knows someone who has several friends who thinks people can't change sex and the people she knows think she is irrational but they all know rational people with friends who know biological reality.

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:42

I tell u what I think I think you don’t have to agree with something to accept it I believe that trans people are murdered abused attack and discriminated agasint because who they are you don’t have to agree with the concept of being transsexual just don’t discriminate against them

You really shouldn't be working with vulnerable teenagers.

BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:40

But they cannot change their sex so for the third time how are transwomen, women?

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:40

I think once civil & legal rights had been achieved certain strands of feminism took us to a place where we ended up with inter-sectional feminism - which almost seeks to deny that there is any real differences between men & women at all - to the point that the sexed body is seen as a social construct - rather than an actual material reality with quite profound consequences.

That was trans activism/ideology & Queer theory.
It has flourished unchecked by/within liberal feminism.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:39

How are they not especially as they can now legally change their gender

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BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:39

How are transwomen, women?

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:38

I tell u what I think I think you don’t have to agree with something to accept it I believe that trans people are murdered abused attack and discriminated agasint because who they are you don’t have to agree with the concept of being transsexual just don’t discriminate against them

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Justhadathought · 05/04/2020 14:38

In a circular kind of way......now that equal legal and civil rights have been achieved ( certainly in the West) I see a need to re-connect to the female/feminine sphere; of re-valuing the traditional female roles associated with female biology.

What makes us women is our body and our biology. That's it! We also need to honour, dignify and find value in that, and in the roles that tend to arise from that condition. In seeking to move beyond the home, and into the traditionally male public sphere, many women have come to see as that as their only area of possible fulfilment.......and yet many women, on having children, would actually like to stay at home - certainly when the children are young. Though the economic and social structures has become such that many women now have no choice but to go out to work.

In general, human beings and human societies need also to reconnect to the planet; to the Earth; to its rhythms; and have respect for them, and work with them for the future of not just ourselves, but for all of the other living creatures that inhabit the Earth.

I think once civil & legal rights had been achieved certain strands of feminism took us to a place where we ended up with inter-sectional feminism - which almost seeks to deny that there is any real differences between men & women at all - to the point that the sexed body is seen as a social construct - rather than an actual material reality with quite profound consequences.

BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:38

How are transwomen, women?

Seventyone72seventy3 · 05/04/2020 14:38

I believe that trans women are women and should be treated as such equally the same with trans men

But when you are asked to explain why, you don't actually have an answer, just vague replies that other people believe it so I'm sorry but you haven't convinced me. I think you are just winding people up.

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:37

Any discrimination is wrong

You believe age-based Safeguarding is wrong?
It discriminates.

BringbackLang · 05/04/2020 14:37

Yes discrimination is wrong but you are discriminating against women by trying to force your idealogical beliefs on them and expecting them to go shut up and go along with it. You are prioritising feelings over actual reality.

MrsDoylesTeaBags · 05/04/2020 14:37

There is no such thing as being born in the wrong body, and if you really are promoting this idea to teenagers who by your admission feel confused then you are doing more harm than good.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:35

I believe that trans women are women and should be treated as such equally the same with trans men

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R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:34

Anyone trans or otherwise who commits any kind of sexual assault deserves to be castrated and strung up. Maybe one way around the shared changing room or toilet issue would be to have single cubicles or toilets as we do at our charity so it doesn’t matter who uses them because there’s only u on there. As a parent and someone who works with children who have been absued I can totally understand the argument for parents wanting to know who the child is sharing a changing room with. Personally I wouldn’t allow my son or my nieces who I regularly look after our without a grown up until they were of teenager age and then allow in groups of friends.

You don't understand/respect Safeguarding.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:34

Sorry pet there is

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