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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Andrew Moffatt No Outsiders online lessons

106 replies

GRAConcerns · 23/03/2020 13:00

NC but regular FWR poster.

So, as the nation's children are at home, Andrew Moffatt is going to be creating videos of his 'No Outsiders' books and assemblies for them to watch.

This is being promoted by schools already and I'm concerned parents will have no idea about the harm this material promotes in relation to girls and gender ideology.

If you work in schools please keep a close eye on this.

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GRAConcerns · 23/04/2020 08:56

Looking at the children's answers in that tweet ( why did Noah's mum feel angry? A: because no matter what gender you are you can do anything)
these children are being brainwashed from the earliest age that you are a 'gender' rather than a 'sex' class.

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GRAConcerns · 23/04/2020 08:52

Looking at the tweet it appears it was a Disney thing. Doesn't say which year.

One of the questions Moffat's worksheets asks pupils (on headed Excelsior paper, so presumably Parkfield pupils ' is 'what is the name of the law in the Uk that says you should not face discrimination because of your gender? Clue: it was made in 2010. Who does it protect?'

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Aesopfable · 23/04/2020 08:45

I can’t think of any group that would hold a ‘princess parade’, a preschool one might hold a ‘prince and princess parade’ but even then I would expect a few ‘boy princesses’ and the teachers wouldn’t bat an eyelid as many little boys dress up on princess dresses.

GRAConcerns · 23/04/2020 08:39

Andrew Moffat (realised his name has one t)
tweeted this yesterday:

'One of the activities in the pack for Dogs Don't Do ballet looks at the real-life story of Noah who was not allowed to join a princess parade because he is a boy. How is this linked to the book and why is it about No Outsiders? #nooutsiders excelsiormat.org/work-with-us/n'

Has anybody read this pack/book?
My son wore princess dresses to school some 10 years ago and nobody batted an eyelid. I'm just wondering whether Moffat is out of touch?

Also, why is it always princesses anyway? (My own son included). Moffat's programme seems to focus on boys and dresses. Isn't there a boy who dreams of being like Phillipa on the science team who dresses in jeans and a Parka? Or, even better, no mention of attire as it's irrelevant.

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NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 16:55

This issue is a bit involved for me (though I really should read up on it) but how can a programme that asks children about ‘girlish’ and ‘boyish’ activities not be sexist? How can you tackle sexism when you are teaching a system that relies on it (transideology)?

Quite, and the books filed under "trans identity" are all basically sexist as it's impossible to talk about this with children in any faintly appropriate way without being sexist.

The ks1 book is about a teddy who is happier when he moves his bow from his neck to his head ffs.

Re 'girlish' and 'boyish;' Those specific lessons are by gendered intelligence.

MoleSmokes · 14/04/2020 16:32

Thanks for all the links and personal insights NeurotrashWarrior !

That school site's search function turns up this for "No Outsiders":

cse.google.com/cse?cx=018064204022535857943%3A-xesnyt2jso&ie=UTF-8&q=%22no+outsiders%22&sa=Search&siteurl=www.outerwestlearningtrust.co.uk%2F&ref=&ss=7599j4952503j19

R0wantrees · 14/04/2020 16:17

How can you tackle sexism when you are teaching a system that relies on it (transideology)?

Exactly.
Also how can you identify and challenge sexism if you can't/don't name sex?

truthisarevolutionaryact · 14/04/2020 16:09

Aesopfable
You're right. The whole ideology is as regressive and dependent on superficial sex stereotypes as it's possible to be. The population are starting to see this - helped of course by the activists who claim that words are literal violence and that the dictionary definition of a woman constitutes hate speech.

Aesopfable · 14/04/2020 16:05

This issue is a bit involved for me (though I really should read up on it) but how can a programme that asks children about ‘girlish’ and ‘boyish’ activities not be sexist? How can you tackle sexism when you are teaching a system that relies on it (transideology)?

truthisarevolutionaryact · 14/04/2020 15:55

How much time are these students spending on these topics
Below is a charter mark scheme that the Scottish primary school (Glencoats) had on their website - the school who welcomed the drag queen with the online porn presence to their school. The amount of staff and pupil time demanded frankly defies belief. Unless of course they have successfully wrapped up all learning issues, SEN, safeguarding, mental health, disabilities and the rest.
It's self indulgent in the extreme.

blogs.glowscotland.org.uk/re/public/glencoatsprimary/uploads/sites/2371/2019/10/LGBT-Schools-Charter-Standards-e-use-003.pdf

R0wantrees · 14/04/2020 15:39

In the preface he's careful to use gender reassignment and sex only.

This was the case in the first book. The introductory chapter correctly named the none protected characteristics on which the book/scheme was to be built. Subsequent chapters & many resources then replaced/conflated sex with gender &/or gender identity.

cf National Education Union report January 2019:

'The results of UK Feminista and NEU’s groundbreaking study are clear: schools, education bodies and Government must take urgent action to tackle sexism in schools. "It's just everywhere" is a study on sexism in schools and how we tackle it.'
neu.org.uk/advice/its-just-everywhere-sexism-schools

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 15:31

Don't think that link works

Andrew Moffatt No Outsiders online lessons
Andrew Moffatt No Outsiders online lessons
NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 15:31

Fallen down a rabbit hole as I know some of these schools. K Salkeld is now deputy head at this school. As an example of how a school can take these things on and run with it, the local trust ran a film competition on the theme of 'No Outsiders' which I'm
Assuming was linked to the programme in Newcastle. This school is a stonewall champion school.

The thing is that a great deal of the premise of the programme is extremely good. The queerness hiding in plain sight, and the issues around gender identity and the harm it can give young people, especially young lesbians, is a huge issue that so many people do not see.

https://www.outerwestlearningtrust.co.uk/stream/news/full/1/-//

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 15:14

How much time are these students spending on these topics?

Not a huge amount in my son's school but it depends. Elmer was a big part of their topic work in reception, making displays etc and "celebrating" or recognising differences between themselves and their friends. There's a book from the programme added to each term's work under pshe. I imagine one focussed lesson but potentially more.

The thing is that teachers have the freedom these days to take something as far as they personally wish.

Under the new ofsted frame work of September 2019, Ofsted have actually stated that one school's curriculum will look different to another's depending on their school community and what is important for those pupils. So a school where there's a range of cultural backgrounds and the risk of racism or also a high number of pupils identifying as trans or bullying has been identified as an issue, the school will tilt its curriculum to address these.

As we've seen in recent cases, a teacher or head teacher who is themselves gay or even trans can cheerlead lgbt and take on quality marks such as stonewall etc..

Usefully there's a current trend for schools wishing to tick all ofsteds boxes to create a mission statement for each subject for the website, and upload the curriculum overview for parents and ofsted to see.

School curriculums were going to be judged under the new ofsted framework in sept 2020; this was pushed back to 2021 in February. Who knows now after Coronavirus.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 15:04

So Gendered intelligence worked with a teacher involved in the original NO project.

In one class, Year Six boys at Hotspur Primary in Newcastle are asked to describe the ‘girlish’ things they like to do, while the girls say what ‘boyish’ pursuits they enjoy.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3298715/Children-young-FOUR-given-transgender-lessons-encourage-explore-gender-identities.html

Goosefoot · 14/04/2020 15:03

How much time are these students spending on these topics?

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:57

The after conference entertainment was appropriate Hmm

This was followed by an optional evening event
“Tit Bits”: An Evening with Bird la Bird
in the Embassy Theatre from 7pm – 9pm

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:55
  • "No Outsiders – Year 6 class in the North east” Katie Salkeld Katie Salkeld’s school became involved with the No Outsiders project in 2008. ''No Outsiders' was a 28-month research project (end date: March 2009) based in primary schools and funded by The Economic and Social Research Council. The project was led by Elizabeth Atkinson and Renée DePalma at the University of Sunderland, in collaboration with researchers at the University of Exeter and the Institute of Education (University of London) and a team of research assistants. Katie relayed her experiences as a teacher in addressing the issue of diversity within her school, from reading books that feature stories around LGBT lives or explore gender variance in some shape or form to a Diversity MADD (music, art, dance and drama) week. Katie Salkeld went onto work with Jay Stewart from Gendered Intelligence and introduced the year 6 to transgendered identities. Katie talked about the work and the

positive impact this has had on the children.
Katie Salkeld
Katie Salkeld has been teaching for 8 years and is currently a year 6 teacher (10&11 year olds) in a North East school and is responsible for the transition between primary and secondary school. As part of the school management team, she is also the Upper Key Stage 2 leader*"

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:54

I can't find the article where I originally found this link but this details where Jay Steward from Gendered Intelligence worked with a teacher called Katie Salkeld in Newcastle schools on early NO trans linked lessons.

cdn0.genderedintelligence.co.uk/2012/11/17/17-46-14-TCC2010_report.pdf

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:41

NO is absolutely being used as part of the prevent strategy in some places.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/fight-against-extremism-ramped-up-14415867

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:30

"About half the original texts remain"

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:29

On this page he details the key changes and lesson changes in the new book:

Andrew Moffatt No Outsiders online lessons
NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:10

If Andrew Moffat is still innacurately referring to gender/gender identity rather than sex within the context of Equality Act 2010 legislation (protected characteristics) this could prove to be a serious issue for The Excelsior Trust.

In the preface he's careful to use gender reassignment and sex only. Talks about the importance of identities however.

There's a huge emphasis on racism and homophobia and where pupils are gay and from a BAME group in the preface.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:08

MBE for his development of the No Outsiders programme.

Renee de Palmer et al must be pretty pissed off.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/04/2020 14:06

Comparing the images I have of the preface to the first book to the latest, he's clarified sex and 'gender reassignment' as being the characteristics outlined by the EA rather than confusing gender and sex, sex was previously non existent.