Amber Rudd and no-platformed at Oxford Uni

Well what happened there??? Sorry about confusing post. Was posting about Chris Patten interview on Week in Westminster where he criticised no platforming and recommended universities to be more proactive.

Copying link again for convenience...

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000gt8v

Grr - fat fingers posted before finished...He questioned whether societies that no platformed should be entitled to name/infrastructure provided by their university. Last item on programme. About 25 mins in:

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000gt8v

The Harry Miller Judgement:

"'Right to be offended' does not exist"

"“We live in a pluralistic society where none of us have a right to be offended by something that they hear.

“Freedom of expression laws are not there to protect statements such as ‘kittens are cute’ - but they are there to protect unpleasant things.

“Its utility lies in exposing people to things that they do not want to hear.”

I am sounding very old, but there is a big tough world out there. Young people will need resilience and an ability to get on with things. Yes they should be willing to fight injustice. But fight, not just take offense.

My own instinct is that Rudds "side of the story" could have been interesting. I suspect there is more to a Minister being scapegoated, than we perhaps see. Essentially politics. I suspect women are more vulnerable than men. I suspect the Home Office, that great, unwieldy Department, is the most difficult of all. May was a champion in not making decisions, but also interesting that this job, in a very clubbable Cabinet, that was the one that went to an Unclubbable woman. Rudd, had problems. Javid in contrast seems to have had a bit of a love in with the Perm Sec, whilst Patel is under siege. I note that there seems to be some briefing from people, who were close to Rudd, essentially supporting Patel. For a student of politics, especially women interested in politics, there would be a wealth of interesting questions to ask.

Next time perhaps they should go with Layla Moran, or Jo Swinson or another woman who has fully drunk the Kool aid. (Lisa Nandy, R L-B). Why move beyond student politics.

And can we have Rudd for a MN web-chat on the challenges faced by women in politics?

nothing compared to the potential hurt to the black and Afro Caribbean feminists and students who felt her presence at such an event would be a direct and personal attack when their families and communities have suffered at her hands.

Don't you think some of them would have relished the chance to talk to her? To challenge her? To educate her about their experiences? I think it might have felt empowering for them.

The trouble is, people are trying to create safe spaces where no one feels threatened but the world just doesn't work that way. Humans are messy and complex and relationships are complex too. People hurt one another and do bad things. The only way forward to a better society is through communication. If you want to create a safe world you will end up sitting in a room alone.

@HesMyLobster What changed on the day to make the vote happen then? Why not days or weeks before? The actions referenced happened months ago. Why wait until the last moment?

The part they objected to was that the event was described as a "celebration" of successful women and they didn't feel it was appropriate to include her in that

Quite frankly, whatever the reasoning behind this action, I'm pleased it has gone tits up in the most public manner possible. Bring it on!

nothing compared to the potential hurt to the black and Afro Caribbean feminists and students who felt her presence at such an event would be a direct and personal attack when their families and communities have suffered at her hands .
We need to knock this on the head that words / ideas are literal violence or are direct attacks on people. Different viewpoints and ideas are the rich pattern of society - even hurtful ideas. Amber Rudd was a democratically elected politician. And yes - this is like toddler tantrums, not befitting allegedly educated people.

Again - if it had been a simple question and answers session the students would have been happy for it to go ahead.

The part they objected to was that the event was described as a "celebration" of successful women and they didn't feel it was appropriate to include her in that.

No it wasn't ideal to let her know at the last minute, but that's on the organisers, not the majority of the students who had been voicing their thoughts since the event was announced in January.

Even if it were reasonable to hold a vote as to whether to disinvite someone because you disagree with something that happened whilst they were in elected office rather than listen and ask questions to hold them to account, you don’t do so half an hour before they arrive. The talk was advertised, the committee knew she had been invited, it didn’t come as a shock to them that she was about to appear!

Dido

The Point is that Some of the students (the organisers) invited her to speak. The rest of the group voted that it wasn't appropriate.

The problem you're having is that you seem to be lumping "them" into one, "stupid, petty little" homogeneous group.
Are you saying these women shouldn't question the decisions of their leaders and peers?

Our mission is for every woman and girl to have an equal right to Safety, Choice, and A Voice

The irony.....

Studies have started to reveal the truth we already know – women and girls everywhere live with the reality of violence and harassment in public

Yes, the data is sparse, studies are small, and attempts to try and stop violence and harassment in public places are not based on enough lived experiences. Efforts need to be joined up to see visible change across the UK

8We are collecting stories and data that represent real women’s experiences, to make sure that leaders are listening, and to get the owners and administrators of public spaces to design solutions that really work. It’s time to take action

Taken from the UNWomen's charter: www.unwomenuk.org/safe-spaces-now

They really do think they've just discovered space travel don't they; or the fact that all the above has been well documented for many decades and is precisely why women require their own spaces. services and sports. The sense that a whole new generation is trying to re-invent the wheel - but at the same time displaying utter confusion about what being a woman actually means.

No-platforming is equivalent to my 3yo screaming for Daddy to get out her room when he’s told her something she doesn’t want to hear

Utterly narcissistic and infantile...and while a natural stage on the journey towards maturity and adulthood...not a state to get stuck in beyond its appropriateness.

The internet and social media has created a world where people really do feel like they can tailor make their own reality in ay shape or form they like - oblivious to what is actually going on, or real, all about them.

But a case of bad manners would be nothing compared to the potential hurt to the black and Afro Caribbean feminists and students who felt her presence at such an event would be a direct and personal attack when their families and communities have suffered at her hands

Oh for goodness sake! The world does not exist, nor the earth turn to protect people's delicate feelings. Life is tough, and often shit. You grow strong by standing up for what you value - not by disinviting people who might offend some manufactured sensibility.

Arguments can only be won by debate. all you are doing is generating a huge, almighty backlash.

Do you realise what many people would give to be able to attend such a prestigious and world class institution such as Oxford? Appreciate your privilege and show you are worthy of that; otherwise you are degrading the whole establishment of excellence with this imported American grievance.

But a case of bad manners would be nothing compared to the potential hurt to the black and Afro Caribbean feminists and students who felt her presence at such an event would be a direct and personal attack when their families and communities have suffered at her hands

What complete nonsense. Even if you believe that, they didn't apologise to that group. They apologised to "wom*n and non- binary"

HesMyLobster

How often does this need to be explained to you ? Did you hear that whooshing noise? It was the point sailing spectacularly over your head.

The students involved EXTENDED AN INVITATION TO AMBER RUDD TO COME TO SPEAK.

Amber Rudd did not ask to be there- she was invited to speak. She wasn't demanding a platform to speak.

Your points are beyond irrelevant. They are petty, vindictive , children who were either too stupid to do their homework about the person they had invited to speak , or it was a deliberate attempt to humiliate her.

I don't know how much simpler I can make it for you.

"You are spectacularly missing the point. These idiots invited Amber Rudd to speak. She didn't ask for a platform to speak. These petty little idiots rescinded their own invitation 30 minutes before she was due to speak".*

"Petty little idiots"*
You sound like a man talking about women with opinions.
These women had an opinion and acted on it. That doesn't make them petty, or little or idiots

You are spectacularly missing the point. These idiots invited Amber Rudd to speak. She didn't ask for a platform to speak. These petty little idiots rescinded their own invitation 30 minutes before she was due to speak.

Chair of society booked Amber Rudd. Others in the society and on the committee, as well as students from other groups raised concerns about whether that was appropriate.
There was a democratic vote amongst the group attending the event.
The result was No, we don't wish to host her or to be seen to be celebrating her and what she stands for.
So they cancelled.
Yes perhaps it was bad manners to take back her invitation.
But a case of bad manners would be nothing compared to the potential hurt to the black and Afro Caribbean feminists and students who felt her presence at such an event would be a direct and personal attack when their families and communities have suffered at her hands.

I'm embarrassed for them

I'm not. That would mean I had some sympathy for them and that they might redeem themselves at some future point.

The three options mean they are either as thick as mince and/or petty and vindictive.

The statement continued, “We are deeply sorry for all and any hurt caused to our members and other wom*n and non-binary people in Oxford over this event.'

Even if you think Amber Rudd is the wickedest person ever in relation to Windrush what the hell has that got to do "wom*n and non- binary"?

If that was the reason for cancellation, which it clearly wasn't, they should be apologising to everyone within their community who came from Windrush families.

Stupid, nasty, pathetic little children. I hope the grownups at Oxford do discipline them.

Isn't that just (2) mind?

These organisers with strong political beliefs must have done one of the following:

1. Booked Rudd without doing any research to see if she shared their politics. Continued failing to do any research in the run up. Noticed on the day of the event. Decided to cancel because she would persuade too many Oxford students to switch to her politics, which don't match the organisers' politics.

1. Knew who they were booking. She is a successful female politician and so a reasonable choice for speaker for IWD at Oxford. The cult got upset and bullied the organisers into cancelling at the last minute.

1. Knew who they were booking. Planned this "prank" from the very start. Now smug at how they stuck it to her.

Oxford used to turn out top people didn't it?

but surely the students attending are bright enough that they could have tackled her robustly on all sorts of meaty subjects. That is far better than denying her the right to speak. What absolute wallies. I'm embarrassed for them

Unfortunately no longer necessarily true.......the art of critical thinking and debate seems to have fallen by the way-side. A degree, or even a doctorate these days need mean nothing much really.

I saw a Labour FB thread about Priti Patel with comments about her clothes, describing her as an ugly bitch, that she is an "Uncle Tom" and has a punchable face. Seems like racism and sexism against Tories is just fine

Absolutely.....and the way Esther McVey was treated and talked about by many on the left was simply disgusting misogyny.