‘Woman or person who gave birth’

"His" vagina. FFS. When will this madness end?

I have a pregnant ‘ man’ as a patient!!! Really struggling with it tbh. Obviously I treat him with respect and kindness. It’s very hard to talk about birth with someone who feels they’re male when they got pregnant through their vagina and the baby is coming out that way!

This biology-defying language is not "inclusive". It is insidious. I refuse to accept it anymore and I will be calling it out every time I see it, no matter what the "nice", "kind", "cool" girls (and TRA tell me to) do.

mother is a verb, though*. But only performed by the female of he species. Nobody would ever suggest a male was mothering anybody.

One of the questions asks how you are related to the baby, be it birth partner, family member or ‘the woman or person who gave birth.’

The other thing I didn't mention is that presumably these questionnaires are handed out to people as above, the birth partner or family member.

This also erases Fathers! Obviously not every woman giving birth will have a partner/significant other and not every partner, if they are male, will be the father (I have known people embark in a new relationship whilst pregnant with another man's child).

Still, fathers, actual fathers are entitled to take pleasure in their new role. Are they not allowed to declare their relationship to the baby as the Father?

And a new Grandparent might also like to proudly announce their new status.

It's a rotten question, dishing out offence to all and sundry.

Mother, is a verb though

Who is saying men are giving birth?

The Guardian for one. Ran a series of articles about a man who gave birth. www.theguardian.com/news/audio/2019/sep/02/the-man-who-gave-birth-podcast

This is about erasure so I will not be told to be kind about it.

They are women. Always will be. It’s not kind to collude in a lie about this.

It is total and utter nonsense and I would cross it out and then say something. Why do I have to be accepting of or tolerant unscientific ideology? Why?

I do not want my children raised with this. If we as women just roll over, we will be crushed. Why does a tiny minority's imagined identify mean that the definition of a woman has to change? Why?

Women give birth. Women. There is no such thing as a pregnant man. C'mon.

It's the pushing of boundaries.

Talking about 'people who give birth' is simply one step closer to talking about 'men who give birth'.

Who is saying men are giving birth? Trans men give birth, who are biological women, this is about calling trans men people rather than women, it’s not about changing their medical records to male or saying men give birth.

I don’t understand any of your post, Tork.
How is it confusing to call the person who gave birth the mother??

Elsie, I am a retired midwife, and I never encountered any men who gave birth, in a career which spanned several decades.

In this context I would be happiest with "person giving birth"

One of the questions asks how you are related to the baby, be it birth partner, family member or ‘the woman or person who gave birth.’

Everyone knows what it means. No reference to gender. This is not a context where they could just say woman because the other options like birth partner or family member could be woman. Mother is no good, because some grandmothers would say "mother" thinking mother of the person giving birth as their role. So, I would not find it offensive to women or data collection to go with "person giving birth"

Referring to a pregnant person on a medical form as male is an absolute nonsense. Just to be nice, wtf!

Calling someone a person instead of a woman makes zero difference to anybody other than that person because it’s true, a woman is a person. The fact that they are pregnant means everyone Is aware that they’re a biological woman, we aren’t talking about amending medical records, we are talking about how people are referred to on a form. There can be just as much if not more confusion when people are called different names to their actual names, I’ve been in numerous situations where it has caused problems.

Stop it with the “trans man will mother the child, of course he will”. Mothers are female parents, by order of the court.

Elsiebear

1. Calling someone Smithy instead of John makes zero difference to anybody because it’s a name, it doesn’t have any bearing on biological reality.
2. Nobody is called a man or a woman when someone is speaking directly to them, it’s not a form of address. Having your correct sex recorded on your medical records is not deliberately offensive to anybody (particularly on a maternity ward!), nor does it fall under the heading of “not nice”.

If you give birth, you are a mother.

Birth mother if you want, but you are the mother.

Mother is also a verb. If a trans man gives birth, will he not mother the child? Of course he will. So he is a mother. If we wants HCPs to refer to him as something else during treatment, that's fine. Nothing to do with me.

Doesn't mean you can take away 'mother' from other people.

There's a lot of strange stuff around at
the moment. I was on a thread were breastfeeding was considered anti-feminist.

It's all getting a bit Brave New World- the book where biological motherhood is banned.

We are not talking about a 1 to 1 interaction, but a 1 to many

But having to refer to the mum of a new baby as Mr Jones would not exactly roll off the tongue.

I work in a hospital and frequently I have been asked to visit patients who want to be referred to by names completely different to their actual names, sometimes I haven’t been aware of this and they have corrected me and said “my name is John, but I prefer to be called Smithy” as an example, I don’t then say “well too bad, your name is John, not Smithy, so I’m gonna call you John, if you get upset it’s not my problem”. You know why? Because that would be extremely rude and unprofessional, because it’s rude to keep referring to someone in a way they’re not comfortable with then they’ve asked you to stop.

I think some people need to recognise that it is impossible to not cause offence. You are either offending people by using sex based terms or you are offending people by using gender based terms

People who object to gender based terms are no less important and human than those who object to sex based terms

It costs nothing to be nice

Is the mantra that was well on the way to threatening so many things that affect women - still may, though hopefully the tide is turning.

It potentially costs a hell of a lot.

And yet women have asked repeatedly not be called cis or uterus havers or ppl with a Cervix or chest feeders

And yet somehow we still are....