What do you think about the rainbow flag?

The swastiker comparison is not just about the appropriation of a neutral symbol; it is about the insidious undemographic spread of a ideology hidden from public, about the silencing of critics, the gestapo-esque reporting and monitoring of rebels through the use of private individuals and the police acting beyond their powers, the repeated statement of untruths and condemning of those who do not follow these, the ignoring of laws and asserting of unlawful discrimination as lawful, the indoctrination of children, the harrowing harms to children in order to prop up the ideology, the removal of safeguarding of the vulnerable, the control of the media...

I think we will know we are winning when Barclays fails to turn its app logo rainbow during LGBT+++++ month. Last year they took about three months to turn it back.

No indication they had any concerns about the disabled, or the elderly, even though they are the most likely to struggle with increasingly impersonal banking. Just the flipping Ts. (I am assuming the recent corporate enthusiasm has little to do with the LGBs, and I do have every sympathy for those with dysphoria. Just a dislike of the whole rainbow stuff).

The rainbow flag has become a corporate branding exercise....that and unicorns....can't get away from them.

I come out in a severe rash every time I see the rainbow flag, these days....I'm allergic.

This is what I mean when I say that once you start looking for swasis, you see them all over the place:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-26369329

www.pinterest.co.uk/suunjata/muslim-swastikas/

br.pinterest.com/pin/24347654219199275/

The swasi existed across cultures and continents for thousands of years before the nazis stole it. It’s origins are mysterious (there is one in the U.K. from the Bronze Age) and the meaning changes depending on what version it is, but they were always positive and lots of people believe they have a kind of magical energy to them, partly because it was already everywhere before people figured how to travel. One theory is that it’s a crude depiction of the sun.

The Hindu version is probably the second best known, but the Native American kind, The Whirling Logs, is probably the coolest. Swasis can be found in the tessellating tile patterns that decorate mosques, Buddha has one in the middle of his chest and there are some on the floor of Hereford Cathedral. Once you start looking for them you see them everywhere.

I expect that’s why the nazis liked it. They were very effective with symbols and uniforms.

I had the great pleasure of meeting ‘Manwoman’ (not trans, just an old hippy, would probably be called a transphobe and cultural appropriator now, or post humously transed as non-binary) and hope that one day his dream, to take the swastika back, is realised:

www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/artist-fought-an-uphill-crusade-to-rehabilitate-the-swastika/article6980663/

Bit of a tangent. Soz.

Still, it’s got to be easier to rehabilitate a rainbow than a swastika!

I'm not a massive fan of the swastika comparison, but I see where people are coming from when they make it.
Same - the point is not to say that LGBTQIABC123=Nazis, which is possibly how some posters may have taken the comparison. The point is the swastika is an ancient symbol of good luck/wellbeing/fertility (I believe ‘swastika’ is Sanskrit for ‘good health’ or similar?), it became very trendy in the early 20th century, and then in the 30s the Nazi party co-opted it and the rest, as we say, is history. It’s about appropriating a symbol and changing it’s meaning completely, not calling people Nazis, but because of that connection it’s clearly an unhelpful analogy and will get people’s backs up!

I'm still waiting for this level of allegiance and support to be stated for people with learning disabilities, those of us who are deaf, partially-sighted, have vision problems etc. etc.

This.

It's been appropriated by the trans juggernaut, hasn't it?

As an aside I very much appreciate rainbow badges and lanyards in the NHS.

I don't. I think people can wear them whilst knowing fuck all about what it's actually like being a lesbian.

As an aside I very much appreciate rainbow badges and lanyards in the NHS.

Why? Would you appreciate Conservative flags and lanyard in the NHS?

I'm not a massive fan of the swastika comparison, but I see where people are coming from when they make it.

When I see the rainbow flag flying, I immediately understand that the institution/organization has been "captured" by the dogma.

Just happened to me, about 3 minutes before spotting the thread. Southwest trains ticket collector has a rainbow lanyard.

What is that all about. Trains should be women friendly, gay friendly, child friendly, racial minority friendly, elderly friendly, disabled friendly, whatever. We have all bought ticket in order to get from A to B, and all we really want from the train company is to do this efficiently.

I looked at the woman collecting tickets and wondered if she had volunteered to wear it or if she had been co-erced. To be honest my immediate associations were woman unfriendly, child sterilisation, prison rape, hostile adherence to cult beliefs rather than reality, intolerance, pups and furries, Yaniv, etc.

Brand imaging gone wrong?

the rainbow flag/lanyard etc is chockablock with straight 'allies', which always feels a bit patronizing, tbh, like wearing a special rainbow badge to prove you're not a bigot is necessary.

IKR. Esp as many woke flag-wavers actually hold incredibly bigoted views in that they don’t tolerate any deviation from TRA mantras.

It used to be called Gay Pride but now it is an industry called Pride. That’s what grated on me, that it’s a cynical marketing ploy.

Back in the 90s and peaceful days of the noughties, I used to love it. Now sadly, it feels like a symbol for the woke washed.

I actually see it as pretty vacuous symbol now, tbh. I've always preferred the flag with the labrys on it anyway.

The rainbow is so ubiquitous it doesn't mean much of anything, really. I used to see it and know there was a safe harbour somewhere around if I needed it, but now I see it and I know it's probably very likely that there aren't specifically lesbian, gay or bisexual related anything involved, it's just a fashionable decoration to display corporate values yada yada yada.

If I see it in conjunction with the trans flag, then yes, I feel fairly unsafe, and I know the network at work which uses the rainbow flag/lanyard etc is chockablock with straight 'allies', which always feels a bit patronizing, tbh, like wearing a special rainbow badge to prove you're not a bigot is necessary.

But yes, mostly just an empty gesture now, a symbol which feels like it's been gutted of it's power as a signpost to safety.

I'm so old that my warm, fuzzy feelings of solidarity are associated with purple flags bearing the labyrys sign which means lesbian strength to me. Rainbow flags came later, and I saw them as corporate virtue-signalling which until recently I thought was a bit tedious and annoying but basically harmless.

These days, however, I associate them with the hostility towards lesbians at Pride, and the endless demands being made by the trans rights extremists at work. I don't feel as threatened by rainbow flags as some on this thread have said they do, but they do make me feel like an outsider which is interesting as someone who's been out as lesbian for nearly 40 years.

I'm bi, but don't feel like I count as I have a husband. However my lesbian friends have become very cautious of places screaming pride from the rooftops. They take a venue on its individual merits but very much feel their identity has been eroded over recent years. One of them to the extend that she doesn't call herself lesbian anymore, she's declared herself 'incompatible with male genitalia.'

in my mind it was synonmous with fantastic bars and nightclubs that were genuinely inclusive of everyone and everyone was free to be themselves and have a great time

I don't really see the mixed scene as genuinely inclusive though, I think there's always been some misogyny directed towards lesbians. I was lucky to be in London when there were lots of lesbian only bars, now there's practically nothing.

Genuinely curious, please could people give some examples of how the rainbow flag is now synonymous with the trans lobby?

I can't speak for anyone else, but in my case, the place that I see it is in my workplace. The LGBT staff group is very vocal, very aggressive (wanting disciplinary action against female staff who so much as look sideways at a man in a dress in the ladies toilets), and very devoid of lesbians or gay people. It seems to consist only of the T part of the name.

For me the reason the rainbow flag is synonymous with trans is because the institutions that are now chanting TWAW and banning women only events or asking for ‘anyone that identifies as female’ are flying it.

When the police are coating themselves in rainbows then ‘checking your thinking’ and ignoring attacks on lesbians whilst escorting ‘lesbians on chairs‘ off the premises, then it’s a trans flag.

I think it’s the rainbow-decked gay bars posting ‘No Terfs On Our Turf’ signs up at their doors that makes many women feel unwelcome. Which is the intention, clearly. Agree that TWAW - with all the implications of that - or you can’t come in. Somehow, that’s given many same-sex attracted women pause for thought about their place in ‘the community!’

Transactivists coopt everything. They are never satisfied. They want the rainbow flag and the suffragette colours to be all about them too.

As an aside I very much appreciate rainbow badges and lanyards in the NHS. Healthcare professionals so often assume I'm straight and seeing a rainbow lanyard makes me so much more comfortable revealing my sexuality (when relevant).

Well thank goodness I'm not the only one
@NellWilsonsWhiteHair

I absolutely dress my children in rainbows at Pride. Because they are children with a lesbian mother

Yep me too.

I am also struggling to see how the rainbow flag has much to do with the trans lobby. When I've seen trans people protest or March for trans pride (I live in Brighton so have seen a few) it's always the trans flag that features.