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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I fucking despair

134 replies

InTheTempest · 24/02/2020 21:34

I frequently read this section but have never posted before.

Just had an argument with my brother tonight about trans issues, self ID, and in particular women's sports. He's a heterosexual man- who I've never heard express an opinion on things like this until now. We were discussing biological males being able to compete in women's sport and he just couldn't see the issue in it. That 'there's always someone who has an advantage for whatever reason so it's just a luck thing'. For example being born in a rich country will give athletes an advantage etc. I tried to explain that we don't segregate sports by those factors though but we do segregate by biological sex.

He also didn't understand the issue over women's rights to safe spaces, minimising it completely- 'people can be dicks to each other anyway' Hmm and basically saying how likely is it that men are going to using self ID to abuse women.

I just give up, I really do. I mean I don't think there's any point trying to discuss these things with people who think like this. I don't have the energy. He was really quite rude to me and tbh I'm pretty angry at that tonight.

I guess I just want to know, how do you deal with men around you who think like this? How do you feel about it? My male relatives wouldn't consider themselves sexist but they are in ways they can't even be bothered to try to understand (my dad couldn't see the issue with grid girls in F1 before).

Just feeling very frustrated with it all tonight. It feels like women will never reach equality.

OP posts:
InTheTempest · 24/02/2020 21:51

I actually thought the issue of women's sport might make it more obvious to men what is happening as well. And make them think about this stuff. Apparently not.

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wellbehavedwomen · 24/02/2020 21:50

Might he watch the BBC Hard Talk around this? Honestly, I don't think most people understand the massive, massive advantage of a male body in sports. I didn't have a clue how pronounced it was until recently myself, either.

What needs to happen is polite factual chipping away, chip, chip, chip. Because we have facts and logic on our side, and while sexism is hardwired into society and that is why this secular faith has been so successful, information in a form people can digest is usually helpful. Speaking up is important - it opens minds a little more, every time. These conversations are the only way things are going to get better. They're why things presently are. But it is painful, I know.

Babdoc · 24/02/2020 21:49

Tell him they are not his rights to give away. His chance of a sports medal or scholarship is not at risk. His safety in a prison or domestic violence refuge will never be at issue.
“You no play da game, you no make da rules”.

InTheTempest · 24/02/2020 21:49

@Siameasy ah that's the nail on the head. Another man who rolls his eyes at the word feminist I think.

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RuffleCrow · 24/02/2020 21:49

I think a lot of people of both sexes hate women and have been waiting for something like this to happen to show their contempt. In my case, it took being a dv victim to find out how much hatred my family of origin had for me. I'd always suspected.

Siameasy · 24/02/2020 21:46

He sounds pretty immature and really he (like most men) A doesn’t care because it will never affect him and B is suffering from male fragility ie having the unpleasant truth pointed out to him causes him more pain than the contents of said truth and it is deny deny deny deflect

It hurts for sure to find out they don’t care

InTheTempest · 24/02/2020 21:44

@LizzieSiddal I think he is a misogynist tbh. Are there actually any men around that aren't? That's what I'm truly starting to wonder.

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LizzieSiddal · 24/02/2020 21:42

Just feeling very frustrated with it all tonight. It feels like women will never reach equality.

You should say that to your brother. If he says he doesn’t care because life’s not fair, tell him he’s a misogynist.

goldenorbspider · 24/02/2020 21:37

So easy to dismiss concerns when they don't effect you.

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