Its becoming more mainstream talking point

I think "dense" is an overly charitable interpretation.

The Malcolm Tucker insult of “you’re so dense that light bends around you” springs to mind.

Wasn't Dawn Butler the one who claimed there were 3,000 rough sleepers in her constituency, when there were in fact 30?

Solid grasp on facts with this one, it seems. Men can be women because they say so. Babies are sexless. Blue is yellow.

People also still think of the transsexuals of yesteryear who were probably gay men. So I think they feel a bit sorry for them. I talk about the topic with anyone who’ll listen (!) when it comes up and people just aren’t aware of the Yaniv types.

Dawn's new mantra: CORED

Campaign. Organise. Recruit. Educate. Discipline.

Nothing remotely Staliney there.

More like BORED

Bully. Organise. Recruit. Educate. Discipline

I think a lot of members of the public simple don't realise the anatomy of many transwomen.

The huge majority of those I have broached the topic with, assume a transwoman is a female person with a trans identity, so whats known as a transman. Hence lots of 'why wouldn't transwomen be in female prisons, they are female!' and such..

@Siameasy
@BuzzShit

Yes - euphemisms galore. I keep writing ‘male bodied adults’ when I mean men and everyone knows it.

Let’s take our language back
Woman - obvs
He/Him
Man/Men
Double mastectomies
Sterilisation
Castration

As the great and sadly late Magdalen Burns:

‘They chop your cock off’

Will be deleted soon...

"bottom surgery”

I got a strike for referring to castration, even though that is what it is!

I agree the language is intentionally infantile, euphemistic and often meaningless or possessed of multiple meanings so whilst the message is getting out it’s still very confusing
“ Top/bottom surgery” for instance. We don’t call mastectomies for breast cancer “top surgery”. We don’t call an episiotomy “bottom surgery” because, in both cases, we are not trying to hide something.
It is all deliberately obfuscating and depends on females being socialised to be nice and not say what they see.
Sadly many people - males too - are like the sheep in Animal Farm.

This is where pronouns are so important. I listened to Posie on the Spiked and Triggernometry podcasts and hearing her say ‘he’ all the time was so refreshing. If people could say he, alongside a picture and name, on MN, in print media and on TV/radio it would be much clearer who is male and female.

I now wonder what other topics they’re not covering properly or pushing a line on but it’s only when you know a topic in depth that you realise what’s going on.

Yes, this topic has made me much more suspicious of news coverage generally - and I considered myself somewhat skeptical before.

ClosdesMouches I too have come across people who think a transwoman is a woman wanting to be a man.

Who does it help that it is not clear, I wonder?
And why are MNHQ pressured to make sure it isn't clear?

I think Dawn Butler is the worst MP to have ever been elected to the House of Commons.

You are naive. Plenty of actual crooks tried, convicted and banged up such as Johnathan Aitken, Denis McShane and Chris Huhne. Some actual crooks who were never caught like Cyril Smith, Peter Morrison and Robert Maxwell. And those who may yet be convicted such as Alex Salmond.

Locally we have Chope. I remember Helen Brinton/Clark in Peterborough who was a violent drunk, arrested more than once, and Fiona whatsername the drunk-driver. Just across from them there was Louise Bagshawe-Mensch who resigned because she was bone-idle and didn't like getting out of bed in the morning.

Plenty more where those came from.

I guess it's like that old saying. “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it".

I think that people wrongly assume that nobody is stupid enough to think men can become women, and so these 'transwomen' must be an actual woman of some sort.

All this "starting from the position that TWAW"

Which explains why the Monitors harangued MNHQ to get the more accurate terms like "trans identified m**" disallowed.

Saying what something actually is throws unwelcome sunlight on those who want to obfuscate and hide.

I think Dawn Butler is the worst MP to have ever been elected to the House of Commons.

Like Angela Rayner, she passed I think no GCSEs or O Levels at school, and then achieved nothing in her career at a union but because she was at a union she was able to apply, via an all women shortlist, to be a Labour MP, and got a safe seat in 2005.

2005-2010 - the only thing of note she did was repeatedly fiddle her expenses, which resulted in her losing her safe seat. But incredibly she was re-elected in 2015, after boundary changes, to an even safer seat. And was very quickly promoted to the front bench because she said she'd work with Corbyn unlike most of the Labour MPs at the time.

And since then all she's really done is tweet about the freebies she gets as an MP, make gibberish statement about trans rights and call for more perks for herself, including writing an article in the Metro last year to demand that she gets invited to appear on Strictly.

DB it turns out from her voting record is not left wing at all, like everything else about her, its fake.

Of course she fake, she's a politician. They are all the same!

DB it turns out from her voting record is not left wing at all, like everything else about her, its fake.
She is an ambitious poser, a self promoting money grubbing fraud.

rightwing, woman hating, ignorant and ruthless

She is left wing, very much so.
The perfect poster child for how all politicians are the same no matter what side they cling to, none of them care for the public.

Someone posted ‘yes but when transmen can give birth’ on twitter yesterday clearly thinking that transmen were not in fact biologically female

I agree that levels of public ignorance are so high that its almost impossible to discuss

The education system in the country is designed to do this.

Just found out Dawn Buttler, while running around withJeremy posing on the left, acutallly voted FOR every bill punishing benifits claiments. she really does hate woment dosent she.
utterly cant stand her. rightwing, woman hating, ignorant and ruthless.

I've had to explain to 2 separate people recently that hermaphrodites don't exist, and intersex people are not "both male and female" or that they don't have both sets of genitalia. One of these people actually has a masters level education in a biological science subject! I agree that levels of public ignorance are so high that its almost impossible to discuss, and TRAs deliberately promote and exploit this by spreading misinformation. Many of them are of course just as ignorant themselves, but they have no interest in understanding better as it doesn't suit their narrative.

Apparently Dawn Butler said on GMB that babies are born without a biological sex

It's amazing the human race has reproduced so successfully for so many years isn't it.

I've said it before, and I'm just going to keep saying it whenever this crops up.

They ALWAYS know who to approach when they want to buy a baby.