All the best to Kate Scottow in court tomorrow

The Mail article appears to have been updated. Lovely pic of Kate.

Just us, happy.

This is what is mind boggling to me, Steph can breezily say that trans women are not women, does that then make them a bigoted te*f?

Or is it just us XX women that get called that, when stating the obvious?

our lawyer friend should also face charges

Sadly we know the Police would have no interest in acting because it wouldn't suit their purposes. It might be possible for someone to launch a private criminal prosecution but that would cost a fortune and could easily go very badly wrong.

It is one thing to take a very legitimate point of view, that trans-women are not women, or that your sex cannot be changed, that is one thing

Ooh, Steph's going to bring the wrath of the TRAs down on Steph's head for that

@MForstater were any of Hayden's gleeful, bullying tweets (e.g. to Caroline) revealed in court?

Having said all that, if Kate is found guilty then our lawyer friend should also face charges. Our lawyer friend is a woman now, so should be treated like one.

Hats off to the Daily Wail for that article

And a shout-out to Mumsnet too!

It’s like a playground squabble. I’m sure school teachers deal with worse every day. To think it has ended up taking two days in a court of law is beyond belief.

I think Kate was an idiot to keep on at Hayden from other accounts, but god, how many socks does Hayden have?

I really hope Kate is found not guilty, but I have my doubts I’m afraid. No matter how stupid it seems to us, or how much it happens to others, or that women get far far worse when the police couldn’t give a shiny one, she did actually do what she is accused of.

I do hope I’m wrong though because I think it’s beyond ridiculous that this has even caught the attention of the police, let alone made it to a court room.

Sometimes you really do have to pick your battles, and having silly twitter spats with our lawyer friend would not seem to me to be a battle worth fighting. Our lawyer friend seems to get into trouble well enough on our lawyer friend’s own.

It is one thing to take a very legitimate point of view, that trans-women are not women, or that your sex cannot be changed, that is one thing

Good, because I have that view, as do most people.

causing annoyance ... to another

Terrible, terrible law. Maybe we should have a work to rule, and just anything that annoys us on t'internet should be reported.

As an aside its worth noting that a person ... for the purpose of causing annoyance ... to another ... persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network means that much of the use of the Internet that is taking place all of the time is criminal. (But of course, the Police will only use the Communications Act 2003 against certain people on behalf of special people.)

That's another stupidly broad law that needs to be thoroughly amended.

But didn't Scottow get arrested for the sort of non crime the FairCop case is against?

No. Scottow's is a criminal case for improper use of a public electronic communications network. It's probably this provision: www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/21/section/127

127 Improper use of public electronic communications network

(2) A person is guilty of an offence if, for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience or needless anxiety to another, he—
...
(c) persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network.

@BustedWench. It was a long difficult day for you today but you showed strength in the face of it all, you were amazing x

From the DM article "Ms Hayden replied: 'It is one thing to take a very legitimate point of view, that trans-women are not women, or that your sex cannot be changed, that is one thing."

Hold on, isn't that considered hate speech if a woman says it?

I'm very confused.

They're very different things - Kate's was a criminal trial, whereas Harry brought a judicial review against the College of Policing

But didn't Scottow get arrested for the sort of non crime the FairCop case is against?

Let's hope this judge knows the difference between a tweet and an email

Thanks for the updates Maya & well done Kate. I hope you have a peaceful weekend.

Is this just a coincidence, or do the results depend on each other?

They're very different things - Kate's was a criminal trial, whereas Harry brought a judicial review against the College of Policing. I'm assuming that the judge in Kate's case needs time to go through the evidence carefully and consider the verdict. So I think it's coincidence, though I guess it's just possible that the judge in Kate's case doesn't want much publicity and is hoping it will be buried by the Harry Miller verdict. That seems unlikely, though.

Is this just a coincidence, or do the results depend on each other?

It would be sensible PR to handle them together (especially with it being Friday and "take out the trash day" in news item terms).

www.theguardian.com/politics/shortcuts/2015/dec/18/take-out-the-trash-day-the-perfect-opportunity-to-bury-bad-news

But it seems implausible that they'd be timed to coincide.

Kate did brilliantly under very stressful questioning.
^
I hope the judge sees what we could all see.
^
These really are the modern witch trials.

Well done Kate

Thank you for updates Maya!

Possibly so. But if you're intent on getting people to pretend they can't see what they can see, reality is a cruel mirror.

So someone has been involved in a "fair few" litigation incidents, but then again, too few to mention.

Regrets, there are none. At least not about the victim of their violence.

And stops singing.

Kate did brilliantly under very stressful questioning.

I hope the judge sees what we could all see.

These really are the modern witch trials.

No one looks like their profile photo though!

It’s like when a group of young women had been convicted of beating someone up in a nightclub or trying to proposition a man on a flight (yes these came up on my newsfeed this week) and they show their social media filtered selfies with huge eyes, perfect skin and huge pouty lips, with little bunny ears or flowers/stars around them - then you see them outside the magistrates court looking far less glamorous!