Father starts judicial review over 'No Outsiders' programme

I simply said that LGB is DIFFERENT to T

Therefore to me it makes sense that any required teaching for one is likely to be different to the other

Don't put quotes around something I did not say.

@midgebabe

it's not about that i think...

"lgb is ok, but t is not."

BUT how, who can say that?
in this situation, stonewall and lots of lgbtq group and supporters
are standing with T.

"a is ok b is not."
i don't think it works.

"just let kids be kid. "
and there has to be cooling period,
and think about what's happening in school.

Of course you can separate lgb from t

The first group is a well understood, factual description of sexuality, a characteristic that tends not you change over a persons life

T is nothing to do with sexuality, and it's nature is not well understood. Unlike homosexuality, it seems that trans population sizes vary tremendously with time/culture/society. It is clear that gender identity can change over a persons life

Yes, CuckooCuckooClock, it's this business that because some protesting parents have some kind of problem with homosexuality this means that the No Outsiders programme must be a good thing.

• I don't know if it's all parents, and I don't know whether their objections are necessarily homophobia. (One of the problems we've got is that in the "phobia" space words seem to have very flexible meanings these days.)

There are some who think that Moffatt purposely chose to teach at a school where any opposition to the teaching of 'T' would become wrapped up with religious stereotypes.

A pp said that out of various religious groups who objected to No Outsiders, the Muslim commnity would take the 'hit'

This blog explores that concept, as well as a more detailed look at Moffatt. Transgender Trend's blog is below also:

coolnessofhind.wordpress.com/2019/02/27/andrew-moffat-and-parkfield-school-weaponizing-lgbt-against-the-muslim-minority/

www.transgendertrend.com/no-outsiders-queering-primary-classroom/

Moffatt is now in a consultancy role at the MAT and his services, in terms of promoting the No Outsiders programme to other schools in the area, are being promoted by educators on social media.

Agree @BritneyPeedOnALadybug everything I’ve read and heard about the protests is that they want no LGBT stuff taught at all. They are homophobic. It’s so frustrating yet again to see the things mumsnet predicted coming true! LGB rights will end up being trashed because of the T

The problem with this situation as I see it is that there are 2 confused issues:

1. The no outsiders program is well dodgy (technical term) clearly a far too paedophile-friendly from what I’ve seen and I would not want it anywhere near my kids (or anyone else’s for that matter)

1. Some of the parents who are vocally protesting at parkfield are homophobic and do not want their children to be taught that it’s ok to be gay.

The trans-promoting press has demonised the parents as all being homophobic bigots, and clearly some are, but I have no idea how many parents who are protesting at parkfield are against the no outsiders program but not against teaching acceptance and tolerance of homosexuality.
Does anyone know this? Have there been any vocal parent protestors who would like their children to be taught tolerance but not under the no outsiders program?

Now there is a mum on who sounds like she has been captured by Mermaids. Boy who liked dolls and dresses so clearly they were transgender....at age 6

i can't understand how can school separate lgb and t education.

the education forced by stonewall in name of
"lgbtq education."

simply 'lgb is ok t is no.' doesn't work.

i think all ideology should be out of school.

"respect people. ok, go and play."

I wish one of our knowledgeable women would ring Maajid Nawaz on LBC right now as they are covering this subject and not really making a great job of it!

@snowblight I don’t agree with your comments normally but on this point you are right. This is at a school very near me and not only have I seen the protests in person, they are featured a lot on our local news and he’s given several interviews. The protests these parents are taking part in ARE anti-LGBT, not just T, I’ve seen it with my own eyes.

Polar bears are cute as a motif on a Xmas jumper but a nature documentary of a polar bear killing a walrus or a whale soon shatters that illusion.

Reminds me of mermaids, funnily enough.

Completely agree with you, Cuckoo

'Some people believe' is great.

'The ONLY RIGHT THING TO BELIEVE and anyone thinking or saying anything else is bad' is what I have a problem with.

These people have an issue with the whole LGBT.

Can you hear yourself with your These people?

It's insane isn't it. Decades of work and we're right back to 'would you let your daughter marry a (insert this decade's social pariahs) Leave voter?'

As opposed to society having learned the core concept that dehumanising on the basis of any characteristic is what's wrong: not just ensuring you're dehumanising based on the current unfashionable characteristic.

michelle many children (including my own) are taught in religious schools. I can not withdraw my dc from the schools religious teaching and there are no alternative schools. We manage just fine with explaining to our children that we disagree with what their teachers say. Children can cope with alternative viewpoints!

Not agreeing with someone doesn't mean that they should be silenced, stamped out of existence or prevented from holding the views you don't share in.

That really is the issue here and always has been. The whole #nodebate

The whole idea that someone holding views you can stick a label on are to be shunned and untouchable as if they're infectious somehow. As opposed to a society that accepts a range of views in a live and let live way, accepting different faiths, cultures, beliefs, but prevents those views being enacted in ways that disadvantages a group of people. Such as by redefining female and removing single sex female spaces .

He has been quoted in the press as being opposed to the teaching of tolerance towards homosexuality as this is at odds with his religion. It’s not racist to call him homophobic- he has said as much himself.

There is also a difference between what a religion teaches and what individuals who are part of that religion , from birth, may actually think and believe. The catholic religion doesn't believe in birth control but that doesn't stop many catholics from taking precautions

I am not interested in whatever good and bad traits the man has. I never really like it when people start digging for dirt or throwing allegations at people to try and discredit them or to destroy support for what they are doing

I am interested in what he is actually pushing through the court.

snowblight This is from the article in the OP:

In a letter sent to Birmingham city council on Friday, outlining the grounds for bringing a judicial review, Paul Conrathe of Sinclairslaw said Hussain’s concern was “that the school has adopted a ‘salesman-like approach to transgender identity’ ”.

I agree with this legal action being taken.

The father in this case is quoted as saying:

“The school teaches that some children are born in the wrong body,” said Hussain.

“This can cause confusion. If my son gets confused about this and about his own body, he might think he is a girl. The school thinks this is OK and has to be accepted, even though transgender can mean medical treatment and surgery which could damage my son mentally and physically for life.”

I think these concerns are reasonable. By agreeing with him on this one point, it doesn't mean that I agree with any homophobic views he might hold. I also don't agree with the views of some Muslims that women shouldn't go outside without covering their heads. He doubtless holds many other views which I would disagree with.

I know this is a very unfashionable attitude to have, but it is possible to totally agree with someone on one issue and vehemently disagree with that same person on another.

We are all different. I find this idea that if you agree on one thing therefore you have to agree on everything else bizarre. It's not how we win campaigns.

Some religions, faiths, beliefs are homophobic, they are not compatible with agreeing with homosexual relationships.

E.G:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-51233003

And for the above:

Think about if Catholicism was the thing being seen as the One True Faith and schools and government and police were insisting your children MUST be taught about hell and taking mass and going to confession, you couldn't withdraw your children from this teaching and the fact that you as a parent didn't believe in this was just your old fashioned bigoted Catholicphobia?

Veganism.
Anti abortionism.
Marxism.
The list goes on and on.

Some religions, faiths, beliefs are homophobic, they are not compatible with agreeing with homosexual relationships. (Note the total lack of homogenderal: it's the homosexual bit that is not ok).

It's illegal to act on homophobia by verbally or physically intimidating or insulting someone gay, or discriminating against someone gay in the ways protected in the equality act.

It's not illegal to hold homophobic beliefs, or to follow a religion that does not accept homosexuality.

It is and should be illegal to teach children in schools that homosexuality is wrong. However when you teach children that not just acting on homophobia but holding homophobic beliefs and faiths, you are teaching children that their family, their culture, their parents are wrong. You are setting up direct conflicts of loyalty. You are intentionally trying to discredit a faith and belief system and break children away from it. You can't expect parents and faiths to see this as a jolly good thing and that your view is superior enough to go along with it.

There's a line. After 5 decades of being lesbian, what I've seen in my lifetime is a gradual increase of tolerance and acceptance and familiarity, it happens through not nagging and bullying and ordering people about and trying to damage their family relationships but by positive life experience of being around gay people. Stonewall have forced this to the point of re arousing intolerance, and teaching parents that this isn't live and let live: this is Rightthink and Wrongthink.

It's done damage. It's the arrogant belief of superiority and the need to destroy conflicting beliefs to establish the One True Faith instead of live and let live.

Have a read and watch for yourself then

www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/protest-parents-back-parkfield-school-16554048