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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Kirkup quoting Orwell; "Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows."

44 replies

MrsSnippyPants · 22/01/2020 12:44

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2020/01/was-this-journalist-sacked-for-saying-sex-is-binary/

James Kirkup seems to pop up with timely articles. Given what has happened to LangCleg, this one he posted today is particularly appropriate.

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BovaryX · 22/01/2020 17:29

The Sun, the biggest-selling paper in Britain and the baddest feral beast in the newspaper jungle, gave full copy approval to campaign groups

It really is quite stunning. Submitting copy to lobbyists for approval is incompatible with press freedom.

GrinitchSpinach · 22/01/2020 17:27

The recent US fifth circuit court of appeals pronoun decision sums up the problem with courtroom use of neologisms and redefinitions of common words:

The panel said federal courts are increasingly asked to decide cases that turn on hotly-debated issues of sex and gender identity. A court may have the “most benign motives” in honoring a party’s request to be called by a certain pronoun but “in doing so, the court may unintentionally convey its tacit approval of the litigant’s underlying legal position.”

www.forbes.com/sites/patriciagbarnes/2020/01/15/xemself-eirself-and-verself---us-appeals-court-wont-go-there/#561ecc6f3711

The problem in journalism is parallel.

To record male crimes as "women's" crimes (rape committed by "her penis" being the most egregious example.; to frame the CT girl athletes' Title IX complaint as seeking to keep "trans females" out of female sports, as even the esteemed Wall Street Journal did recently, is to obscure the facts.

In trying to be courteous to some people, journalists are granting their highly disputed political premises. This is not sound journalism.

ThePurported · 22/01/2020 17:27

The other day someone posted a link to a Twitter thread by a Liverpool Echo journalist which brilliantly demonstrated the problem, but I can't find it now.

BovaryX · 22/01/2020 17:19

ThePurported

Thank you for that link. It's absolutely bloody outrageous. But it does explain the compliance of the press.

BovaryX · 22/01/2020 17:17

MrsSnippy

Thank you. I have just had a quick look at that. Wow. Interesting how it states at the outset it isn't intended to influence editorial decisions.... and of course the usual organisations dominate page 10. No wonder so many journalists are so silent. Thank you floisme this board is an education, appreciate the resources.

MrsSnippyPants · 22/01/2020 17:11

That's the one! Thanks floisme and ThePurported

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ThePurported · 22/01/2020 17:08

Bovary Julie Bindel wrote about it recently.

thecritic.co.uk/issues/january-2020/triumph-of-the-trans-lobbyists/

"Paul Clarkson, managing editor of the Sun, mounted a strong defence of the paper’s coverage: Winterbourne and Graf had approached the Sun about coverage, he said. They wanted the story to be printed. Warming to his subject, he then revealed more than he might have intended: “Every word, headline and image was passed by transgender groups pre-publication.”

Perhaps the significance of that sentence might not be obvious to non-journalists, but to those in the trade it is fairly shocking. The Sun, the biggest-selling paper in Britain and the baddest feral beast in the newspaper jungle, gave full copy approval to campaign groups.

Not that Clarkson was alone. Peter Wright, “editor emeritus” at Associated Newspapers and former editor of the Mail on Sunday, said his group was very keen to have its journalists receive training and guidance from trans advocacy groups. Or rather, more training. “We have talked to them in the past and taken advice,” he told the MPs.

These admissions went unremarked upon and unreported. It suits none of the participants to admit that the supposedly mighty newspapers that are commonly accused by activists of whipping up a climate of transphobic hatred are, in fact, so meekly compliant that they let transgender groups vet their reporting and train their staff.

Where did the Sun and Mail get the idea to ask trans lobbying groups how to write about trans issues? I would hazard a guess that the impetus came from Ipso, the press regulator. Its Guidance on Transgender Reporting includes a list of “resources” for editors to consult: All About Trans, Trans Media Watch, Stonewall, Gendered Intelligence, and Mermaids."

Floisme · 22/01/2020 17:06

I think that article was by Julie Bindel - or it may have been someone else but Julie who retweeted it. Think it's on Julie's twitter page. I'm supposed to be working but I'll try and find it later.

MrsSnippyPants · 22/01/2020 17:05

Look which organisations IPSO points at as resources for a start (bottom of page 10)
www.ipso.co.uk/media/1275/guidance_transgender-reporting.pdf

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MrsSnippyPants · 22/01/2020 17:02

Oh yes Bovary there was an article about the IPSO guidelines, might have been Janice Turner, might have been James again?

I'll see if I can find it......

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BovaryX · 22/01/2020 16:58

Articles are submitted to trans orgs for approval before publication

ThePurported seriously? Just incredible. Harry Miller made exactly that point about the police. They are being trained by Stonewall and they are implementing policies which have no legal basis This tactic is deliberate. They are an organised, relentless lobby operating sub rosa.

ThePurported · 22/01/2020 16:49

The linguistic battles are absolutely central. And it's about control, the desire to dictate the narrative and punish transgressions.

Yup. And media orgs are censoring themselves beyond what the law actually requires. Articles are submitted to trans orgs for approval before publication, and the IPSO guidelines are a joke. For example, they require journalists to use 'preferred pronouns'. It's self id in practice, and IPSO members are acting as enforcers.

Mayomaynot · 22/01/2020 16:11

Excellent article. Scary times.

NoSquirrels · 22/01/2020 15:53

That is a great article. Should be required reading.

Language always matters. Always.

GrinitchSpinach · 22/01/2020 14:10

This is a great piece. I share his frustration at how few journalists are addressing this honestly.

Uncompromisingwoman · 22/01/2020 13:10

An excellent article - and even the normally toxic comments under articles in the Spectator are starting to shift with far more commentators understanding the threats to free speech and women that this movement poses.

BadgertheBodger · 22/01/2020 13:09

Such a good article. I’ve enjoyed watching Janes Kirkup progress from wanting to keep his distance and not offer his opinion to “actually I’m not having it, sex is not a spectrum”. Excellent.

RicketyClickety · 22/01/2020 13:06

It is very well timed. There is so much we aren't allowed to say in regard to transgenderism and gender.

So many coy euphemisms to mask what is happening.

BovaryX · 22/01/2020 12:59

Great article by James Kirkup. The linguistic battles are absolutely central. And it's about control, the desire to dictate the narrative and punish transgressions. But it has a truly Orwellian underpinning. It's about the ideology behind Newspeak. That if you remove words, the ideas they reference will cease to exist. And if you subvert the meaning of words, the new definition will upend external reality...

^Language is very important to transgenderism and its influence over institutions. Like all orthodoxies, it has approved and forbidden language, holy words controlled by a priesthood ready to punish those who say the wrong words.
Hence the police chief who spends time telling people which pronouns to use. Hence the officers who question people for misgendering or other unacceptable speech online^.