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Original poster

Can anyone explain to me (related to TRA)...

63 replies

ThePeckOfPickledPeppersPeterPi · 13/01/2020 17:29

... how the TRA movement can sometimes risk being homophobic?

I'm beginning to see clearly some issues with erosion of women's rights. I also saw a suggestion somewhere that some aspects of the movement could potentially negatively impact gay men or women, but not a full argument. Can anyone explain this further? Thank you!

(PS I blame Glinner. I was blissfully unaware of most of these issues till recently).

OP posts:
Original poster
ThePeckOfPickledPeppersPeterPi · 13/01/2020 17:49

OK, this makes a lot of sense - thanks, @Feminazgul, @OldCrone and @FleetsumNJetsum.
This is very complicated.
So the idea is that people are transitioning, or being encouraged to transition, in the absence of true gender dysphoria (e.g., directly or indirectly to "avoid" being gay). I can see how that might be a risk - and is there also some evidence you could point me to which shows how often this happens? An occasional thing, or frequent?
Thanks again all

OP posts:
Melroses · 13/01/2020 17:48

There is a clash between the idea of seeing the people in the world by gender identities, and same sex attraction.

Sometimes people of the same 'gender' are not of the same sex.

Encouraging/coercing homosexual people into relationships of the same gender but not the same sex is not too dissimilar to encouraging homosexual people into relationships with the opposite sex as used to happen in days gone by (in fact it is just the same).

There is also the problem of affirming young people as the opposite sex/gender on onto medical pathways to transitioning when they have not fully developed physically, emotionally and socially and may turn out to be same sex attracted.

MrsWooster · 13/01/2020 17:47

Beat me to it, crone!

MrsWooster · 13/01/2020 17:47

And the approach to young people and gender non-conformity. TRAs look at gender non conforming young people as trans, rather than viewing (most of) them as people (sensibly) rejecting sexist stereotypes. Erasing many of the gay men and lesbians of the future.

FleetsumNJetsum · 13/01/2020 17:43

I have heard the idea, too, that some TRAs believe that if you are a gay male you are just a transwoman without the courage to transition.

Actual gender dysphoria, and the existence of homosexuals is a distant memory for some.

OldCrone · 13/01/2020 17:43

Many children who are gender non-conforming grow up to be gay. These children are now being taught that their gender non-conformity means that they are 'trans'. So transing children can be seen as a way of making sure there are fewer gay adults in the future.

Feminazgul · 13/01/2020 17:42

Theres also the implication that homosexuals are just trans people who havent realised it yet, which is erasing homosexuality and homophobic in itself.

Original poster
ThePeckOfPickledPeppersPeterPi · 13/01/2020 17:39

Wow, OK. Thank you @smemorata and @SpartacusAutisticus. I was going to ask whether this was just a theoretical risk or whether anyone had experience of it happening. Looks like that book might give an answer? Is this something people are aware of happening in "real life" then? Sorry if these questions are naive/offensive to anyone.

OP posts:
Original poster
ThePeckOfPickledPeppersPeterPi · 13/01/2020 17:37

Thanks @NotTerfNorCis

lesbians are bigots if they wouldn't consider transwomen as sexual partners
^ Blimey - really? So to say, as a woman, that you only fancy biological females is bigoted?

I'll Google the cotton ceiling - many thanks

OP posts:
Cascade220 · 13/01/2020 17:36

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Cascade220 · 13/01/2020 17:35

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smemorata · 13/01/2020 17:34

As far as I understand it it's because it doesn't accept the idea of same sex attraction just gender identity so lesbians are expected to date trans women who identify as female rather than just women.

NotTerfNorCis · 13/01/2020 17:32

They don't accept that people are sexually attracted to one another based on sex, not gender. So for instance lesbians are bigots if they wouldn't consider transwomen as sexual partners. Google the 'cotton ceiling' for more info.