Anyone else have a woke teen?

DD doesn’t believe in the TRA stuff, and says her friends are aware of the Canadian waxing case due to youtubers.

She’s a student at one of the unis that have cancelled speakers for terfery, but says the ordinary students don’t believe in the trans stuff.

@Justhadathought

Thank you!

Playing chess with a pigeon. Great metaphor, don’t know about far left tho, the image that came to me was of Mr Trump, strutting his stuff.In that situation, Stones, where you didn’t start it, and if you swore to be kind, I might have asked to be released from my promise. Although I am Trappist when belaboured by the woke, and I very often am so belaboured.

Thank God DD (18) is gender critical, as are my cousin's two daughters in their twenties, who are absolutely staunch GC feminists and have no time for the woke mantras.

I haven't come across many actual 'woke' teenagers on this issue; they all raise their eyebrows and say what a load of crap the TRAs spout.

I had to bite my tongue at a family gathering this Christmas while a niece held forth with all sorts of woke shite including transwomen.(JKR came up) . It was especially annoying when her cousin started to disagree with her, but pretty badly as she wasn't up with the facts and figures. Miss woke was quoting her tutors words you could tell. I was itching to step in and put her right but I had promised my wife I wouldn't say anything.
The smug look on her face when she eventually bullied her cousin into silence was all I could take so I left for another slice of quiche. I'd did make me laugh though as it reminded me of he old saying about debating somebody on the far left is like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be a grand master but at the end of the day they will knock all the pieces over, shit on the board and strut around on it like they've won.

Young people do seem to be under a lot of social pressure to 'identify' as something. I guess this is an inevitable outcome of social media and the individual, tailor made worlds that young people inhabit these days.
Problem is, mental health issues are are at crisis state amongst the young today. So much fragmentation.

My son (12)has some awareness around trans, from TV etc.. Is instinct is to be nice and kind, which is great, that how I have brought him up. He does however recognise the difference between reality and fantasy, which is also great. I have been talking with him about sex and gender. He is very interested in sex, being in the throws of puberty and is quite receptive to conversations around abouts. I have been clear that I am not having any nonsense language about 'identifying as' and 'gender fluid', that we must speak in plain sensible English, not bonkers word salad.
He tells me that he is going to identify as a fidget spinner, which gives me hope. Setting an irreverent tone from the outset.
Is it wrong of me as a parent that we now call transitioning Fidget Spinning?

Sounds like you'll lose her badgering her with your opinion.
It's hard when they differ to what you feel is right or important, but it's her life, leave her be

This is a thread for the parents of teens and young adults to discuss an issue that is very important to them. We all have our own ways and styles of interacting with our children. Mine have all grown up now - but as an ex-teacher and as someone who was very politically motivated, active and idealistic when a teen myself - I find it an interesting area for discussion.

Sounds like you'll lose her badgering her with your opinion.
It's hard when they differ to what you feel is right or important, but it's her life, leave her be.

There are plenty who don’t agree with your views, who fully understand’what it means to live as a woman

Actually don't think that is the case......what this is about is youthful idealism...and most of us have been there ourselves...until reality dawned.

..and a few more:

*I know there are loads more examples/pictures - anyone8

I've started saving and compiling photographs whenever I come across them. Useful resources. Here's a few:

But in the past people presented in all sorts of gender non-conforming ways. The difference is that back then nobody thought this made them change sex. Surely that makes the past more progressive than now, where everyone is encouraged to fit into a 'box

Yes, where we are now is definitely retrograde. Totally reliant on the pharmaceutical and medical industries in order to feel like oneself. And even if presenting as 'non-binary' or 'pansexual' without the need for medical assistance - then there is an essential denial of earthly reality. And earthly reality is something we need to get to grips with pretty quick as a species living on the earth.

Simply more drugs, more technology and more consumeristic mentality is not where we need to be going. Mind/body integration is where it is at.

And she had a point. I'd feel threatened by a man self ID-ing as a woman coming into the woman's loos but God help that trans woman if she'd gone into a men's toilet in the city

Feminists are often accused of castigating all men as violent potential rapists...which is clearly not the case....but are there really hordes of men waiting in toilets waiting to attack a feminine, slightly built man?

I got in early with DS14 and his best friend. They overheard me arguing with woke DH and asked me to explain. So I did. They are now GC. Helped along by having my DBro and SIL living with us, they are hugely GC and DS adores his uncle and hangs on his every word and view. DH will come round and be de-woked, but he is only just coming out of a LibDem fog, so needs some space to adjust...

Maybe you could learn from your teens if you weren’t so superior and patronising.

There are plenty who don’t agree with your views, who fully understand’what it means to live as a woman’ 🙄

My son believes that transwomen do differ from natal women but we fall out over the fact that there is an explosion in the numbers of children presenting as trans

It would be interesting to ask him how many 'out' lesbians there are at school?

My dd2 however is extremely woke and literally cries if I try to discuss the subject (has trans friends etc) so we currently agree not to discuss it. I have hope that the conflict between her feminism and her wokeness will start to make her more aware of the issues as we get older.

My ds, meanwhile, has no truck with the woke at all and is very GC.

As a result of this thread, had a chat about all this with dd1 who I thought was moderately woke. Am relieved as it turns out she's largely unaware of stuff and when I point stuff out is open-minded enough to listen. She wanted proof of some of my claims (quite reasonably) - can anyone point me to a good single source for pictures of transwomen in sport? I know I've seen lots of individual examples but also individual threads etc with lots of examples - does anyone have any quick links on this so I can show her easily?

I think that this issue in particular works well visually.

I did show her a twitter thread on Hannah Mouncey which I found quickly, but she just said, with some reason, who cares about handball anyway?

I know there are loads more examples/pictures - anyone?

By the dictionary definition, most teens are woke. "verb
past of wake1.
adjectiveINFORMAL•US
alert to injustice in society, especially racism.
"we need to stay angry, and stay woke"

My ds, almost 16, is bemused that society has got itself so torn in bits and is bemused. Most definitely doesn't believe people can change sex and listens to his gay uncles that there is more going on than is immediately apparent.

"I always express to her that she can be a girl in whatever way she wants to be."

And this is the absolute nub of the issue.
Being a "girl" is not a bunch of feminine stereotypes, it's about biology.
If a boy wants to look like a girl, dress like a girl, walk and talk like a girl then he should be allowed to without all this fucking nonsense.
Ditto the girl who refuses to wear skirts, dresses and make up, and has a buzzcut and is a welder. STILL female, despite not conforming to the bollocks gender stereotypes.

If this shit had all been around when I was a young teen I have no doubt that some well meaning woke type would have pushed me down the trans route - I was vehemently anti-girliness and wore only gender-nonspecific clothes such as jeans, tshirts, baggy jumpers etc. I did wear eyeliner but then so did most of the boys of my acquaintance (80s). And that scares me shitless - at that age, puberty can be quite scary, especially for those on the spectrum (not me but I still hated it) and a denial of it isn't unusual. But to then pathologise it and tell these kids that "they must be trans" is sickening.

Be who you want to be, dress how you want to dress but never expect you can change your biology - you can't.

Nope. Like another poster, we live in the East Midlands where woke culture hasn't really reached yet. DD is a rugby player who loved beating up playing the boys in primary school years but would be horrified if a 'trans girl' joined her team now (and I know the coaches/club wouldn't stand for it).
Not a lot sinks in but in know that her whole class laughed and rolled their eyes when a blue haired representative from an LGBT group came to give a talk. Unfortunately I don't think anyone out and put challenged it though.
I always express to her that she can be a girl in whatever way she wants to be.

Sylvester - You Make me Feel.

Yes, recently I was reflecting on my teenage years in the 80s. So many feminine men and we didn't really think anything of it. My dad on the other hand was totally puzzled by it all.
David Sylvian: absolutely beautiful.