Domestic Violence shown as humour...

Personally I wouldn't like to see old films having bits sliced out of them to make them "acceptable now" - it's our cultural history

This
I love On The Buses.
Where would it end? There's loads of comedies that aren't PC and wouldn't get away with now.
I've noticed old programmes get chopped when they're repeated now - Only Fools and Horses, Friends, etc being just two of them.
I see it like burning or censoring books - surely it's better to have a conversation about the subjects rather than outright censoring them?

The first On the Buses film was an enormous box office hit in 1971. The plot involved the male bus drivers waging a campaign to get rid of the newly-appointed female drivers, which they did by such guaranteed-to-get-rid-of-women methods as putting spiders in their cabs.

It's a reminder that back in the 1970s, it would have been perfectly OK and normal for a company to specify that bus drivers must be male. There was no legislation to prevent it in those days.

The past is a foreign country. They do things differently there.

That said, TV in particular was very influential in the late 20th century so if students in 2040 want to actually see what was broadcast in the 70s, better to show them it unedited, with the Miss World pageant, cigarette advertising, and ten hours of the test card.

I suppose it's like looking at old texts. It's easy for people who don't know much about a particular time period to read something that is 100, or 500 years old, and really misinterpret it, because they don't have the references or mindset that the readers it was intended for had. It may take for granted certain kinds of experience, a particular sense of humour, knowledge of tropes, even just conventions of language.

Television almost seems too recent to think that would have such an effect, but now that I have a longer memory of seeing things at the time, and the way people see and interpret them now, it can actually be pretty significant.

FlyingOink
Blue Peter never represented my childhood, it's some TV guy's idea

Good point, the TV guys and camera crew have had it their way for far too long.

Let us not forget Little Britain.
It was somewhat racist and fatist at the Fat Club.
Ageist and misogynist at the care home.
And somewhat transphobic at the seaside.

And not that long ago.

Comedy. It makes us laugh.

Al Jolson, far from being a horrible racist which was the impression I had, was involved in anti-racism and was respected in the African American community.

That's interesting. I guess if we cancel everything that can be deemed problematic we lose all of the actual history, which is rarely as straightforward as we paint it.

All media represents what its owners want it to, Blue Peter never represented my childhood, it's some TV guy's idea.

That said, TV in particular was very influential in the late 20th century so if students in 2040 want to actually see what was broadcast in the 70s, better to show them it unedited, with the Miss World pageant, cigarette advertising, and ten hours of the test card.

The violence goes both ways - Olive hits Arthur at least once in that film - from memory, when he falls asleep after the end of holiday disco, when she was hoping for sex.

The point of the comedy was that Arthur was an awful husband and Olive was a terrible wife. It doesn't seem very funny now, but it's a product of its time and very interesting from the perspective of cultural shifts.

The segment where the toilet explodes is still quite funny.

The films take place in a different canon from the series, where Olive and Arthur have a child. In the series, they eventually divorce, with no children involved.

Some were, some weren't. Mind Your Language wasn't poking fun at racists they way Alf Garnett did.

For sure. What I find worrying? I guess, interesting? is that some people don't seem at all able to pick up on that kind of criticism. I wonder how anyone can miss so much, people who are supposedly educated? It reminds me a bit of Biblical literalism. It makes me disinclined to hand over the censorship pen to anyone.

I also do wonder how much our perception becomes skewed around what was considered bad in the past. When there was the big controversy around Trudeau's costume photos I was interested to lean, really by chance, that Al Jolson, far from being a horrible racist which was the impression I had, was involved in anti-racism and was respected in the African American community. It made me wonder if people now aren't making some unjustified assumptions about the feelings and motives people had with regard to his shows.

There seems to be a lack of ability to consider that people may have been thinking in a way you don't expect - I'm afraid I'm not describing what I mean very well, but I can't think of a better way.

I think On the Buses has aged the worst of the sitcoms I watched as a child (didn't watch Love thy Neighbour, which has to be the least savoury of the lot). Arthur and Olive had a horrible abusive relationship. Arthur, who was no oil painting himself, constantly put down Olive for her appearance and uselessness, yet he didn't seem to have a job and was happy to sponge off Olive's family. She should have LTB and her mum, who they lived with, should have thrown him out.

Sitcoms reflect social mores and it's interesting to watch old series. The message from On the Buses is that this relationship is ok.

We get a skewed version now.of what we watched back in the 70s. Carla Lane's comedies (Liver Birds, Butterflies) centred women with very different messages from On the Buses, but they aren't shown.

I was re-watching Men Behaving Badly over Christmas and while there was no actual violence there were plenty of suggestions of not-entirely-consensual sex as being funny

I'm not sure how I feel about tbh - Fawlty Towers couldn't be made in the same way now. The Irish builders, for example, as well. Should I feel guilty for thinking it's one of the funniest comedies of all time?

The problem with Fawlty Towers is because it's clever and witty. For example Basil's rant about the guest who was disappointed with the view.

What did the guest expect to see from the window of a Torquay guest house ? A herd of wildebeest sweeping majesticaly across the veldt

On The Buses had nothing like that.

In fact I think it was a BBC exec who said they would never hire the Monty Python guys to do a comedy troupe show today, because they were all white Cambridge types. So, yeah

What an utterly stupid reason.

I've seen a lot of demands that certain shows be retired because they break current taboos, and the people making the demand seem utterly unaware that the show was actually being very critical of what it was depicting.
Some were, some weren't. Mind Your Language wasn't poking fun at racists they way Alf Garnett did.
I don't think they should be altered at all. Content warning beforehand if necessary. It's important to see how people were not that long ago. And yeah, you can laugh at funny parts of a comedy without stamping your approval on everything else about it. I can appreciate Marvin Gaye for his musical talent without that meaning I approve of him holding a knife to his wife's throat or using her as a sex slave.
Dig deep enough into any media or art and you'll find something disturbing.

Ah, that explains it well, Goosefoot, thank you. I agree.

Fawlty Towers couldn't be made in the same way now.

In fact I think it was a BBC exec who said they would never hire the Monty Python guys to do a comedy troupe show today, because they were all white Cambridge types. So, yeah.

The premise being that serious or really unsavoury behaviours shouldn't be used as comedy?

I don't know that I buy that, TBH.

I also don't buy the idea that because something is shown on tv without being obviously labeled as Bad Behaviour, that we are meant to think that it is being promoted or that the creators think it isn't a big deal. Do people really think John Cleese believed it was not so bad to beat up your employee?

Even beyond realising that depiction doesn't necessarily mean approval, in the last few years I've seen a lot of demands that certain shows be retired because they break current taboos, and the people making the demand seem utterly unaware that the show was actually being very critical of what it was depicting.

I'm asking why it was seen as acceptable

If the police were called to a domestic violence incident in those days they were very reluctant to intervene. Prosecutions for dv were almost unheard of - a man could get away with hospitalising his partner but get done for criminal damage because he broke a window to get in her house.
Marital rape was "acceptable" in the 70's as well. There was no such thing as sexual harassment at work either.

Times have changed because women made a noise.

No, the B&W Minstrel Show couldn't be shown now - I hope we don't end up losing stuff like Fawlty Towers the same way.

You can still see clips of the Minstrels on youtube though - important to be aware of it, and the cultural significance of it I suppose.

I'm not sure how I feel about tbh - Fawlty Towers couldn't be made in the same way now. The Irish builders, for example, as well. Should I feel guilty for thinking it's one of the funniest comedies of all time?

Yes "On the Buses" is awful. It was awful back in the day and 100 times worse today. I think there is an issue with the amount of repeats of so many progs out of their time ... it reinforces to those that are happy in that time it was great back then and ok to behave in a mysoginist, racist way and enforcing stereotypes. I think we should write to the programmers about this ... my experience with young adults is though, that they find it boring and wont watch it, good for them.

Personally I wouldn't like to see old films having bits sliced out of them to make them "acceptable now" - it's our cultural history

One either has to take the view the work so unacceptable (Black and White Minstrels) it can no longer be shown ; or the work retains some merit and objectionable bit is not a major part of it.

I agree cutting out part is the worst option.

Fawlty Towers is interesting - there is physical abuse of Manuel and verbal and racist abuse based on his being thick and from Barcelona.

The OP is complaining about 2 seconds in a film which was never held in any artistic esteem. The abuse of Manuel in the highly regarded Fawlty Towers happened in every episode.

I like "On the Buses".

TV on in background, this morning. Old film, 'Holiday on the buses' is on. I realise this is a pile of misogynistic crap

Why were you watching it at all then? You clearly knew what it would be like.

I appreciate that complaining about the poor quality of holiday TV is a national sport but even with just a freeview package and catch up there are dozens of options available. A "pile of misogynistic crap" on ITV3 can't possibly have been the least worst option.

I expect it was shown as part of a very cheap job lot to fill a non prime time slot for ITV3 involving little thought or analysis.

SpongeBob - did you ever see the tv programme "it was alright in the 70s" ? Because that probably explains it well - these were pre-pc times, where comedies had an incredible amount of sexism, racism, casual violence - that just wouldn't be acceptable now.

Fawlty Towers had Basil regularly whacking Manuel too, Benny Hill & Kenny Everett showed literal sexual harassment of women. Different times - the past is a foreign country and all that.

Personally I wouldn't like to see old films having bits sliced out of them to make them "acceptable now" - it's our cultural history.

I guess it's a good thing if men hitting their wives is not depicted in comedy so much now, since a significant minority of them still do it in real life.

But I am so over this cancel culture.

It must have been funny back in those days.
Didn't Andy Capp's wife hit him with a rolling pin, or was that another character?