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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Where is it written that you DON'T become Mrs X?

104 replies

MsChnandlerBong · 22/12/2019 22:37

We got married in March. I didn't change my name. We have received MANY Christmas cards addressed to Mr & Mrs Whatever. I didn't change my name.

When I tell people "Oh, I haven't changed my name", they tell me that actually I did. I got married and LEGALLY my name has now changed. Now I know this isn't true but I would love to point people at a piece of legislation or something! It's beginning to irritate me. I am NOT Mrs hisname. I'm, as I've been for forty years, Ms My name. Help me!

OP posts:
Lamahaha · 23/12/2019 12:02

You don't change your name, and even if you do, it's still not necessarily your legal name.
Case in point: my daughter has an EU passport from a different country. She married in the UK and took her husband's name. She is officially Mrs Hisname.

Earlier this year she applied for a new passport from her country, but they would not accept her name as Mrs Hisname. She would have to officially change it in that country in order for it to be recognised, a process that takes several weeks.
As she needed her new passport urgently, she applied for it in her birth name and got it.

Gizmo79 · 23/12/2019 12:00

You should see the mess that has happened to my DH who has taken my last name!

milveycrohn · 23/12/2019 11:59

I think it is actually social etiquette, from the past.
ie Technically, married women do not automatically change their names, and have to provide documentation if they want to be known by their married name (ie if they want to amend their passport or bank account). In the past many women would not have had a bank account, or passport, or have a profession, (for which they may prefer to continue to use their own name), and yes, I am going back many years.
So social etiquette is that married womem were address as Mrs DH Initials, DH LastName; A widow was addresses as Mrs DH Initials, DH Lastname , and divorced was Mrs Her Initials, DH Lastname, and I well remember my widowed MIL getting annoyed because she had a letter addressed to her as Mrs (Her Initials) DH Lastname, which to her indicated divorced rather than widowed.
So I suspect it is older women who do this, rather than younger people.
Nowdays, all this is gone, and I try to address everyone the way they have asked to be addressed.

tobee · 23/12/2019 11:55

sashh Grin

DDIJ · 23/12/2019 11:50

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MsChnandlerBong · 23/12/2019 11:46

is this really worth arguing with your friends about? It’s only meant with kindness I’m sure

See I disagree with this completely. It isn't kind to call someone the wrong name! People do it because they cannot cope with the fact that I didn't want to be Mrs Hisname. They don't like the fact that I'm being an uppity feminist so they write Mrs Hisname to say to me, look, you can pretend that your Ms Yourname but really we alllllll know your Mrs Hisname. It's the opposite of being kind! It's disrespectful and rude.

OP posts:
anxioussue · 23/12/2019 11:45

If you change your name you don't have to change your passport until the next renewal, you just book your travel in your own name.

sashh · 23/12/2019 11:43

It is nonsense. Registrars do not and never did hand out passports- which is what you wrote.

I didn't.

BTW you are very good at being rude, is it a natural talent or one you have had to practice?

MsChnandlerBong · 23/12/2019 11:42

I think what irritates me the most is how patronising people are about it. It's as though they smile indulgently at me, whilst thinking that of course I'm Mrs X. I've had the why did you get married, you aren't a real family comments and they just make me laugh, but I get really pissed off with people telling me what my damn name is!

OP posts:
ColaFreezePop · 23/12/2019 11:39

@YourOpinionIsNoted it's not confusing.

If you get married or have a civil partnership either partner can change their lastname to the other or double barrel it using the marriage/civil partnership as proof of the name change.

If you change your lastname for any other reason and want official recognition, you do it by deed poll.

You then change the name on your passport (and driving licence) using that proof. After that you can change names on other things.

(Oh and it's weird calling it a maiden name. The few straight men and the gay men who change their last names definitely aren't maidens.)

EveryKingdomOfRain · 23/12/2019 11:35

Not complete nonsense, just a misunderstanding. If you want to travel immediately after marriage then you apply for your passport in your new name and it is dated to start the day of the marriage

It is nonsense. Registrars do not and never did hand out passports- which is what you wrote.

sashh · 23/12/2019 11:26

But I think it did used to be the case; my dm got married in the 60s, in a registry office, and remembers the registrar officially handing over her new passport in her new married name

That is complete nonsense.

Not complete nonsense, just a misunderstanding. If you want to travel immediately after marriage then you apply for your passport in your new name and it is dated to start the day of the marriage.

The registrar / minister who will conduct the ceremony has to sign and I believe, in the 1960s, it was 'held' by the person conducting a marriage and was handed over afterwards.

YourOpinionIsNoted · 23/12/2019 11:23

This is quite confusing though isn't it?

If you want to change your surname to your partner’s surname, you don’t need a deed poll. Provided your marriage certificate records both your maiden name and your partner’s surname, the marriage certificate is sufficient evidence of your change of name.

So if you do want to change to dhs name you also don't need to do anything??

I changed last name to his on marriage (my family name is that of a famous and loathed politician!). I haven't done anything at a government level, just showed bank etc my marriage cert. Has my legal name actually changed or not?

DDIJ · 23/12/2019 11:17

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sashh · 23/12/2019 11:15

dementedpixie

Or you can just start using the name you want to be known by.

This link from Deed Poll website spells it out pretty clearly:

Yes because they are trying to get your money.

You can write your own deed poll for a fee of £0, all these places calling themselves 'deed poll office' etc are not technically conning you, you pay for a service that they provide, but you can do it yourself for free.

They also don't need to tell you that you don't need a deed poll to change your name.

My first experience of the name assumption was when I was in my first proper job, the company did a weekend away for employees + 1. I was asked for my boyfriend's name for the booking, I was fine with that, I wasn't fine with them booking me in as Mrs boyfriend's name.

Notahandmaid · 23/12/2019 11:03

Slightly different but I hate being called Miss (not married, but cohabiting and have been a Ms since I questioned why women had two titles to distinguish the married ones from the unmarried ones when I was quite young).

To get the message across to friends/relatives, I got little address labels with 'Ms Notahandmaid' and my address printed out that I put on the back of every personal correspondence I send out.

Most of my friends/relatives have got the hint but others steadfastly refuse and I think they ones that refuse are the old fashioned ones who think 1. feminism has gone too far, 2. there are only two correct titles, 3. they are just generally dim and haven't read the labels that I've put on the back of every Christmas card, every letter, and every birthday card for the last 15 years.

It might be worth getting some address labels printed out with your correct title & name on like I've done. Vistaprint (not on commission!) do loads of designs quite cheaply.

DDIJ · 23/12/2019 11:00

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tobee · 23/12/2019 10:39

Re changing your name by deed poll, there are two ways you can do it (from a cursory reading of uk government website) enrolled or unenrolled. The unenrolled type may not be accepted by some organisations as proof of name change e.g banks. There is a fee for doing this except on change of name due to marriage/civil partnership when it's free ti change documentation. It's different in Scotland.

brendansbuddy · 23/12/2019 10:26

I was really annoyed when the (obviously new, rather inept) registrar said 'Congratulations Mr and Mrs Hisname' to the assembled wedding crowd. I lamely tried to say 'Im not changing my name!' but it got lost in the fray. Should have formally complained. In-laws regularly sent Mrs HisFirstANDSecond name cards throughout my marriage despite bring told. Once they sent a parcel and it cheered me to tell them the PO wouldn't give it to me as I had no i.d. But it's been bloody handy to have kept it since getting divorced Grin

LasthingIlldo · 23/12/2019 10:19

In laws just stopped addressing post to me at all when I specifically asked them to send all packages to me in Ms.Myname, as I was asked and had no id in Mrs dhname when collecting a parcel from post office.

All post including my birthday cards were posted to dhfirstname lastname after thatHmm
Supposedly what's the point of getting married and keeping your own name and the married name just becomes your legal name until you die even if you divorce.
Same in-laws were very confused when a friend reverted to maiden name after divorce (ex had remarried also so there was a new Mrshisname). That conversation was a joy to explain and way more difficult than it needed to be :friend is using her own name from now on as she is no longer married and no its not illegal.

tobee · 23/12/2019 10:16

If you change your name you have to change your passport. Which is not the same as having to change it on marriage. So if my dm, back in 1963, changed her name from her maiden name to her husband's name, she needed a new passport.

However, this would be the same at any time you changed your name. For whatever reason.

Where is it written that you DON'T become Mrs X?
CrissmussMockers · 23/12/2019 10:14

It's all convention.

John Smith marries Mary Jones. Legally, she becomes Mary Jones, Mrs John Smith. 'Mary Smith' is an abbreviation.

OhTheRoses · 23/12/2019 10:12

I always think that Mrs Jane Smith is divorced. Ms Jane Smith is better.

I use Ms professionally if I have to. Never Mrs my first name but then I am old and old fashioned. I cannot imagine my dc buying into any of this.

Times change and one has to move with them. Older friends I address the Christmas cards traditionally, younger ones I try to put John and Jane; same sex couples John and Pete and both or a shared surname. It's a minefield but I doubt people try to offend on purpise and I'd hope most people are just pleased tk be remembered and to receive a card or invitation. One can spend a lit of gime being offended and I'm not sure it's worth it.

tobee · 23/12/2019 10:11

He did officially hand over the passport, in the manner wibdib says! Which is not the same as "issued" which is what the passport office does

EveryKingdomOfRain · 23/12/2019 10:05

tobee

EveryKingdomof course the registrar didn't issue the passport! Aswibdibsays is I believe what happened

This is what you wrote

But I think it did used to be the case; my dm got married in the 60s, in a registry office, and remembers the registrar officially handing over her new passport in her new married name

That is complete nonsense.