Liverpool Women's hospital no longer has female toilets

Daughter has an appointment there tomorrow in the Ante Natal Clinic.I have asked her to do a recce.

How can this be legal?

If men have a mens toilet but women do not have a womens toilet its not legal, its a breach of the Equality Act.
Its illegal for them to treat women less favourably on the grounds of their sex.
This also discriminates against BAME women who are not permitted to use a mixed sex toilet, on the grounds of their religion.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/13

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/14

I would be interested to know about staff loo provision.

Someone needs to go and do a recce.

*neatly

I took it to mean the toilets were labelled "Patient" toilets, which I suppose is fair enough in a hospital where all the patients are expected to be female. It might not necessarily have been intended to be a gender neutral choice of word though it nearly sidesteps any issues.

Oh I cross posted with Fanny, I'm confused now!

as far as I can remember, the toilets on the ward I was on are 'patient toilets'.

So presumably these weren't gender neutral then, but female only?

There is a loo area by the reception/entrance area. The women's toilet has half a female toilet person and half a male toilet person on the door and says something like these toilets are for all genders.

So these are for visitors then? OK, so that is slightly less batshit, but still pretty awful if the male toilets are still left male. And also pretty ridiculous in the context of the fact that of all places, a fucking WOMEN'S hospital should know what a woman is and should be centering them first and foremost.

Thanks @El2El

So basically gender neutral for all patients.

Presumably pandering to the occasional trans man who needs to access services there. The only surprise is they haven't renamed the hospital itself.

Liverpool Women's NHS Foundation Trust runs Liverpool Women's Hospital, a major obstetrics, gynaecology and neonatology research hospital in Liverpool.

Thanks (I could have googled that myself I guess 🤦‍♀️)

So why the need for 'gender neutral' toilets then?!

@fannycan as far as I can remember, the toilets on the ward I was on are 'patient toilets'. There is a loo area by the reception/entrance area. The women's toilet has half a female toilet person and half a male toilet person on the door and says something like these toilets are for all genders. I didn't use any the other toilets so not sure what it's like throughout the rest of the hospital. I e been going there almost weekly for a couple of months and using these toilets each time. They've only just been changed.

What does the Women's Hospital treat? Is it exclusively female conditions such as pregnancy, birth, gynane issues, or is it any issue but just in a 'women's setting

Liverpool Women's NHS Foundation Trust runs Liverpool Women's Hospital, a major obstetrics, gynaecology and neonatology research hospital in Liverpool.

Gave birth there last weekend. Blew my mind when I saw it.
So are the loos on the maternity ward now labelled Gender neutral @El2El ?

From the web site I can't see any obvious evidence of services that could be for men.

Liverpool Women's Hospital featured in one of the episodes of the BBC Hospital series a couple of years ago

'Liverpool Women's' has featured on several series of 'One Born Every Minute' but also more recently on another discrete series which was looking at several specialist trusts within Liverpool. I think this may be the programme you are referring to?

The issue of difficulty in recruiting consultants is one which has only recently been aired; but also comes at a time when the trust wants to shut down the hospital ( just 25 years old) and re-build closer to the main teaching hospital a couple of miles away.......It is quite a contentious issue - because the hospital holds a special place in the hearts of many in the region.

It's a really good job that hospitals aren't massive magnets for seriously dodgy fucked up people otherwise this would be a massive sexual assault scandal just waiting to happen.

No I was giving birth 😁

@El2El

Did you say anything?

Gave birth there last weekend. Blew my mind when I saw it. Absolutely gobsmacked that a WOMEN'S hospital would do this. This is a facility specifically focussed on the treatment of females. One would expect they'd have a very particular understanding of the issues with this.

'What Natural said. From an in-patient POV, their ward loos and bathrooms are probably some of very few that we can guarantee are still single-SEX, however patients identify.'

Thing posted unthread from the hosp confirms toilets for patients are 'single gender'.

Newspaper piece says gender neutral toilets will be 'fitted' in public buildings, which is very much not the same as changing the sign on the door of the ladies

These orgs should surely be leaving the ladies alone and making the gents gender neutral? Given difference in queues etc and women's facilities being too few all over the place, it's the only thing that makes sense.

Our tube station has done this btw. Gents is gents, women's got changed to anyone.

Pisses me off tbh.

What does the Women's Hospital treat? Is it exclusively female conditions such as pregnancy, birth, gynane issues, or is it any issue but just in a 'women's setting'?

I just don't understand why this would even be an issue? If its the former then even the most woke, desperate to validate transwomen setting just wouldn't be treating anyone but females anyway?

Liverpool Women's Hospital featured in one of the episodes of the BBC Hospital series a couple of years ago. I can't find the episode on YouTube or iplayer. But from what I remember they have a serious problem recruiting senior consultants because it is a geographically isolated hospital (geographically from the other main hospital services, I don't mean that it is in the sticks). This causes problems, which can be dangerous.
Those routine laparoscopies? A well known possible complication is accidental perforation of the bowel. LSCS? Possible bladder damage. Sterilisation? Possible accidental tying off of a ureter rather than a Fallopian tube.
If any of these events happen it is a surgical emergency that requires the assistance of surgical specialists from other specialisms. Specialists who won't be present on site and have to be called in from whichever nearby hospital normally provides assistance.
Thus many excellent specialists don't want to work under these potentially hazardous conditions, hence they have a major recruitment problem.
That is my summing up from memory of some key issues discussed on the programme. (Happy to be corrected if anyone knows differently).

I only raise this because if they do MtF srs surgery I would have thought they would need to ship in specialist help that wouldn't normally be present on site and I wonder if this is the hospital best suited to provide those services.

Apart from it being a Women's Hospital obv.

I don't get this? Why would any transwomen even be using the patients loos in a 'women's hospital?'

Sorry but no way.

Please complain to PALS: www.liverpoolwomens.nhs.uk/patients/pals-comments-suggestions-complaints/

And the Chief Executive:
www.liverpoolwomens.nhs.uk/about-us/our-board-of-directors/chief-executive-directors/

I've been scrolling through the hospital twitter and there are lots of pictures of smiling staff. Nearly all of who are (or appear to be) women. Have their toilets all gone gender neutral I wonder?

This is outrageous. Women at a women's hospital are likely to be more vulnerable - pregnant/in labour/post-natal/undergoing gynaecological treatment etc etc.

Unisex facilities increase the risk of abuse/attack.
So these vulnerable women are potentially even more at risk now.

Wtf are they thinking? We need to fight this.

According to twitter the hospital provides hormone treatment to Transwomen. I have no idea if this is correct.

I suppose gender services are fairly niche and presumably cover both sexes. Bet some of the laydees love the validation.
But I would have thought MtF surgery would be done by a specialist urologist and also for follow up care eg anything involving a prostate so I'm not sure why it would have been done at a women's hospital.