Mrs Gove/Sarah Vine in the Daily Fail

My problem is that it doesn't seem particularly "decent" for the spouse of a politician to use their column in the most popular newspaper in the country to launch specific attacks against their partner's political enemies (whether I agree with their arguments or not)

That is ridiculous. Sarah Vine is a journalist- pick apart what she said in the article. The suggestion that she should not write it because of who her husband is simply telling her to shut up- that she isn't entitled to an opinion. It isn't the first time she has written on this subject.

Also, FWIW, I don't insist on calling her "Mrs Gove", but I think that it is a useful shorthand for highlighting to people who may not know that this is not your standard objective (as much as they can be) journalist, but someone with some serious skin in the game

Serious skin in what game? Pointing out the idiocies of Lib Dem policy. They don't stop being idiotic just because it is the spouse of a Tory MP who is pointing it out.

Sarah Vine really, really wants to live at 10 Downing St

Does she? From what I’ve read in her columns over the last decade, she’s not keen on the intrusion of family life that comes with PM territory.

She's bright, articulate, ambitious, and gives zero fucks. Though, she'll have to give the occasional one to Michael Gove, I guess. Surely that's worth a suite or two in Buckingham Palace?

What a shitty thing to say. Fine, you’re not attracted to Michael Gove. But why do you assume she’s fucking Michael Gove for a nice place at the Palace? Your comment has reduced her, as a woman, them as a couple/partnership, and their family.

I'm not really arsed about her opinion on gender.

FWIW, I am a man. I first came across the "trans rights" arguments through Jordan Peterson arguing against pronouns, then came onto Mumsnet (for other reasons) and decided I agreed with the arguments regarding single-sex spaces and trans-women in sports - there are two sexes, it's mental to suggest otherwise, and women need sex-segregated spaces. Happy to see men in dresses, make-up, fill your boots chap. You're still a bloke in a dress, but good for you.

My problem is that it doesn't seem particularly "decent" for the spouse of a politician to use their column in the most popular newspaper in the country to launch specific attacks against their partner's political enemies (whether I agree with their arguments or not).

Also, FWIW, I don't insist on calling her "Mrs Gove", but I think that it is a useful shorthand for highlighting to people who may not know that this is not your standard objective (as much as they can be) journalist, but someone with some serious skin in the game.

If Gove himself had written the article, I wouldn't have a problem, because it would have been clearly noted as a party political article.

So women deserve to be called by their own name. Unless they’re married to a prominent Tory. Gotcha 😉

I'm having great difficulty understanding your point brain. If you are "gender critical" there is nothing in what she is saying (beyond possibly the "vulnerable" bit) which hasn't been said time and time again on here.

So what if she is a Conservative supporter? Or is being "gender critical" a lefty only view?

And your insistence on calling her "Mrs Gove" is about as un-feminist as I can think of.

My experience is that her articles are often human interest rather than party political. She has been a journalist longer than her husband has been a politician.

Worrying that a leading female politician does not understand what a woman is, does not strike me as ‘partisan’. Any paper should be asking the same. The fact that the Guardian does not suggests something is wrong with the Guardian rather than something is wrong with Vine.

Some women (Posie, Farrow, now Vine) really seem to attract the haters. Weird. It’s as if women should not be opinionated.

It is a reasoned conclusion. To anyone other than ardent TRAs anyway.

Sarah Vine has written gender critical articles in the past - this isn't exactly out of character.

Plus from what I hear - despite Jo Swinson repeatedly making a fool of herself on this topic - most of the electorate will be voting on brexit and the NHS.

My problem with it is that it looks like an independent journalist coming to a reasoned conclusion, when, in fact, it is a highly-partisan journalist with an enormous personal interest in a Tory victory attacking their rivals in a column in the most popular newspaper in the country.

And to be honest it often looks the other way round, like she is the brains behind him.

Sarah Vine really, really wants to live at 10 Downing St

What evidence is there of this?

This thread is pretty dreadful - starting with calling her "Mrs Gove" and the suggestions that she's being influenced by her husband rather than coming to her own views.

Sarah Vine really, really wants to live at 10 Downing St

I'm not sure she does. She has children in our nearest school. If DD had got a place at that school (borough boundary in between) I may well have known her. From what I hear she is fine. Working mum and all that. SamCam wasnt keen to move into No 10. I assume Sarah Vine would support her husbands career, but I suspect she is equally happy to remain relatively under the radar, and have her own.

FWIW I assume the same is true for Corbyns wife, and Swinson's husband. Marriage inevitably involves compromise, but there is no sign any are rushing to play spouse in No 10.

Dont allow yourself to be misdirected

Misdirected from what ?

I'm not being misdirected. If the Conservatives were likely to win in my constituency I would vote Conservative. As it happens I'm in Lib Dem/SNP marginal so no matter how awful Jo Swinson is, I will be voting Lib Dem.

I think Sarah Vine believes everything she wrote in that column.... but schools, councils, charities and prisons have all implemented self ID since the Tories came to power. Karen White was sent to a women's prison under a Tory government.

Sarah Vine really, really wants to live at 10 Downing St.

She's bright, articulate, ambitious, and gives zero fucks. Though, she'll have to give the occasional one to Michael Gove, I guess. Surely that's worth a suite or two in Buckingham Palace?

It is interesting to note that the margin in Surrey Heath (Mr Gove's constituency) has narrowed considerably and he is under threat from a LibDem contender - Alasdair Pinkerton.

Polling puts Alasdair just a few % behind Gove and tactical voting of the minority party %s could swing that against Gove.

It really is beginning to look like the media are being sent out each morning with a list of permitted topics. ie dont ask anyone but swinson about trans rights and women's rights.

How convenient for the Tories to have an ally in the most widely read newspaper by women in the UK to deflect everyone's attentions away from the damage the Tories have already done to women's rights and somehow make it look like it is only the fringe Lib Dems.

On each of these threads where everyones goes oooh look, swinson being interrogated, and I have to say again.

Dont allow yourself to be misdirected.

This is about protecting the 2 main parties, one of which will be our Government by this friday, who will be implementing anti sex based rights legislation without anyone putting them in the firing line.

If anything it shows that despire a wide range of campaigning by a number of groups and individual women, the erasure of women's rights had just not registered.

All it is now is a tool in party hatchett jobs on rivals.

Totally fed up with this manipulation.

I think it’s an excellent article. Thanks for the link @Gingernaut.

I quite liked her article on her swishy hair the other week . It didn’t influence me to get extensions though.

I’m glad she is able to talk openly about a topic that is sensitive. Maybe one day she won’t be able to.

Sarah Vine is not unbiased, regardless of how much we agree with her on one point

"Unbiased" on what and to whom?

I agree with her on quite a lot.

I'm really disliking the implication that Sarah Vine didn't come to her own conclusions and opinions.

It's not about her opinion being validated by being married to Gove. It's about the likelihood that gender critical arguments of a sort being fed into the highest levels of the current government and probably the next one. This is significant.

I'm intrigued about the "Mrs Gove" problem

Whilst recognising that it's not the name she goes by, and that wives aren't husband's property, I think it is actually a handy reminder to show those who may not know that this isn't just some independent journalist, but the wife of one of the most influential figures in the government

Then say "for those who don't know she is married to Michael Gove"

Although why she as a journalist expressing her opinion has to be validated in even that way escapes me. I'm not married to Michael Gove- I share Sarah Vine's opinion of Labour and the Lib Dems.

It has come as a shock to me to find that I share an opinion with La Vine.

Little - this is a side point to the op, but I agree it would be good to have one room female only, but I also think it’s important to have baby change rooms available for men also. The stereotype that mums must care for infants isn’t helpful and often it’s a baby change in disabled access toilets only that dads can access- even though this baby change is for parents with disabilities (unless it’s the only toilet in a small cafe or similar). I know it’s a tiny side point, but often there’s a lot of ‘poor helpless’ dads who can’t take the baby out because there’s no change facilities they can access and I found it super irritating when I was a new mother that so many mothers seem stuck arguing against this point with their partners as it’s not common to find a change facility in male accessible toilets or change rooms.